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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-12-2016, 03:59 PM Thread Starter
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Water Pump Died (Surprise!)

I have a hard time not writing books to explain myself. If you don't like stories, skip to the bottom.

Just bought one of these lovely cars, it had ~146,000 miles and good oil change records.

I didn't do enough research (possibly any, considering how many water pump threads and videos there are out there) and therefor neglected to ask her about the water pump maintenance.

Judging by the spark plugs and radiator cap I just replaced, it is the original water pump.

Well I've checked the oil and weep spots every day, sometimes several times a day since I put it on the road a little over a week ago.

On Sunday, my wife was going to see her cousin so I told her to take it and give the van a break. Well, a ways into the country, she reports that she saw a bit of smoke (thought it was dust but it atleast made her paranoid, she's a smart girl) and about 1/2 mile down the road she notices the heat climbing. She pulled over and shut it down and we got out there with a trailer.

I inspected the oil, it doesn't appear to be milky. There were several puddles of coolant in the various crevices at the top of the engine. I haven't looked at it much because it turned into a shitty day so I have no idea where it blew out of.

After it cooled off quite a bit, we started it and drove it off the trailer.

Ironically, 5 minutes before she called me, I had just completed my order for a new water pump and timing chain kit. I was going to replace it and just put my mind at ease for atleast 70k miles.


Long story short, I ordered this Evergreen TKTCS5027HWPT2 00-04 Dodge Chrysler 2.7L Timing Chain Kit Water Pump (SBEC cam gear) Timing Cover Gasket (Search on Amazon, I can't post links yet). I then did some research and found that they made some changes to make it heavier (and hopefully last longer). Anyone know if this meets the new specs?

I searched for evergreen and found them recommended as an OEM alternative for other parts and mechanically inclined family members acted relieved when I told them the brand name.

[edit]Additionally, considering the engine got pretty hot; Is there anything else I should be concerned with? I've been reading the water pump change procedure and know to check the radiator hose and transmission while I'm in there. I know after cooling, it started up and drove off the trailer (filled it with water and shut it off as soon as it was in my drive)

Last edited by JJerrell; 07-12-2016 at 05:22 PM. Reason: Further questioning
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-12-2016, 07:17 PM
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I hate to disappoint you, but, judging from the gasket in the picture, the water pump shown on Evergreen's Amazon page is not the much improved design (that's the original problematic gasket design, which also means the pump itself is not the later beefed-up design). (I'm not familiar with the Evergreenbrand, but that's neither here nor there.)

If it were me, I'd cancel the order.

I would strongly suggest going only with the OEM part on this particular water pump to ensure getting the improved gasket and pump design. Also, the aftermarket tensioners have proven to be very unreliable - sometimes right out of the box. See if Chrysler lists package deals including the chain, water pump, and tensioner (if you have to buy the tensioner separately, so be it).

As far as any damage to the engine from overheating, it is very unlikely. My radiator side tank split open when I was driving my 2.7 a few years ago, dumping every drop of coolant in seconds. Without realizing what had happened (I thought the puff of steam that I saw was from my having run through a small water puddle at the beginning of the trip), I ended up driving it over 4 miles with no coolant in it. The engine got so hot that it wouldn't start a minute after shutting it off. I thought it was toast. But it must not have started due to heat either causing vapor lock in the fuel rail, or the engine sensors temporarily to not work. Amazingly, after I let it cool for a half hour, it started, sputtered for a couple of seconds and hasn't missed a beat since. Still running strong at over 270k miles.


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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-12-2016, 07:23 PM
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Also - I'm thinking the loss of coolant may be due to either a hose bursting, or a radiator side tank splitting - very common at the age our cars are now - usually, but not always, on the rear of the passenger-side side tank. Oh - also the coolant reservoirs are known for splitting due to brittle, aged plastic.

BTW - I didn't change the water pump and chain in mine until 207k miles. I only did it then out of fear of engine damage if something happened - everything was still working fine.
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 01:02 AM
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What about the coolant outlet housing?
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 03:23 AM
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^was thinking about that as a possibility before I scrolled down (since he said there was coolant all over the top). Don't see the model year of the car listed, and I can't remember when they made the switch to the newer design.
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 07:27 AM
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What about the coolant outlet housing?
Duh!! Yes.
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 08:24 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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What about the coolant outlet housing?
Thank you all for your replies! I was hoping to do it this weekend but I'll get the order cancelled or sent back asap. I would rather do it right.

I'm sorry I'm a bit of a noob. But are we thinking it's the coolant outlet housing that went and not so much the pump? It would make sense to me that it would be something else due to the location of the coolant I found.

EDIT: I'm at work right now so I can't inspect it and I don't know why I didn't look at it before.
If this: http://ww2.justanswer.com/uploads/js...epidengine.jpg
is what you're talking about, I noticed a small amount of coolant leaking from it when I first started driving it. I checked it periodically while I was checking the oil but never inspected it after this happened the other day. It would be awesome if this is all I needed to replace immediately, just need to find someone local that carries it so I don't have to wait. I fell in love with this car for some reason, I don't care if I give it a little love to keep it on the road. I'll drive it till the wheels fall off.

Last edited by JJerrell; 07-13-2016 at 09:36 AM. Reason: Update
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 10:17 AM
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That's it. The one pictured is an old style housing. They moved the bleeder into the line. As I recall that is also an item you want to go to the dealer for.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 12:58 PM
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That's it. The one pictured is an old style housing. They moved the bleeder into the line. As I recall that is also an item you want to go to the dealer for.
Absolutely. They are in aftermarket, but they are all made by Dorman (marketed under other brand names in some cases), and they don't last long, so get it from the dealer.

You will want to get the outlet housing *and* the metal pipe because if you only get the new design housing and re-use your old pipe, you will be without a bleeder. IIRC, they have one part number that is just the outlet housing, and another part number for the pipe, and a third part number that includes both parts (that may have changed) - but in any case, get both parts.

Get the pipe-to-outlet housing o-ring too - it probably comes with the parts, but not 100% sure of that.

There are four screws that attach the outlet housing, *but*, unfortunately, you can't get the two rear screws out without at least loosening all the screws holding the plenum down so you can raise the plenum up enough to get those two screws out.

Not required, but I suggest that you totally remove the plenum because a lot of dirt and grit tends to settle under the plenum around the gasketed area so that when you lift the plenum up, some of the grit falls over on top of the gaskets, and you'll want to clean (vacuum) that off. I'm not saying that it won't seal if you leave the grit, but there is that risk. Consider also getting new plenum gaskets - they're very inexpensive - go OEM or Fel-Pro.

Take the opportunity to flush the cooling system and put in all new full-strength G-05 antifreeze diluted 50/50 with distilled water. (G-05 would be Zerex G-05 (yellow), Chrysler/Mopar 5 year/100k mile (orange), or Ford/Motorcraft VC-7-B Gold (yellow, comes in red container).)


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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 02:18 PM Thread Starter
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I'm just looking online because I'm at work right now. Want to make sure I get the correct parts from my local dealer.

Water Outlet PN: 5017183AB
Found at moparpartsforme.com -- Still unable to post URL's

Is this the new style? The image in the diagram looks a lot like what I remember seeing in my car.

Also, which pipe in the diagram on that page are you suggesting I replace or would you happen to know the part numbers? Dying to get home to make sure that's the issue, super excited that I might not have to tear the engine down and hopeful that I can find the part local.
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-13-2016, 09:40 PM
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That's actually it - and it's the one that comes with the metal pipe. Chrysler *never* updates their parts sketches even if the earlier design part looks nothing like the actual new part - such as this one. If you want to see what it looks like, go on ebay and search "Chrysler 5017183AB". Ignore the ones with photos (not sketches) that don't show the pipe and that show the bleeder screw on the top center of the housing - those are all aftermarket crap ones (old design, inferior quality) trying to fool you into buying them - they usually don't show the Chrysler part number in the listing title. No aftermarket ones come with the pipe, and, again, the bleeder screw is always in the top center of the housing, not in the pipe right next to the housing like the new-design OEM ones. The genuine OEM part is from Chrysler dealers that are selling on ebay - usually (not always), they show the Chrysler part number in the listing title. Pricing is almost always a good bit lower than local dealers, and shipping is usually free. Some of the Chrysler dealers on ebay also are the same dealers with their own sites with discount pricing (which generally approximately equal their ebay pricing when you add shipping that they'll charge) - sometimes you can figure that out by what city they are located in. Sometimes people selling genuine Chrysler parts are not dealers but brokers or individuals who bought new-old stock from dealers selling off old inventory or going out of business. Generally that's for older obsolete parts. Nothing wrong with buying from those guys - can be a little more risky, but generally OK if their feedback is in the high 90's.

Here's one with photos: Thermostat Water Outlet Vent Housing 5017183AB Mopar 98 10 2 7 Engine | eBay

I forgot that the metal pipe also includes the almost 30" long smaller diameter metal heater core supply pipe that goes under the lower intake manifold (branches off of the bigger metal pipe that has the bleeder welded onto it). You don't have to remove the LIM - you push start the far end of the smaller pipe under the LIM at the front of the engine, and slide it back until the outlet housing lines up with its mounting holes - at which point the heater supply pipe will be poking out the rear of the engine ready for you to connect the rubber heater hose.

One additional tip: When you go to pull the old assembly out, it won't budge until you remove a bracket screw at the back of the engine - a little hard to get to, but not too bad. Without removing that screw, you will break something if you try to force the assembly forward, but once that screw is out, it will slip forward and out easily. That should save you about 1/2 hour of scratching your head and/or breaking something. You're welcome! LOL!


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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-14-2016, 05:19 PM Thread Starter
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Sweet, I got the part ordered from my local dealership down the road. He will have it by tomorrow morning and I'll put it together after work. I need to brush up on the cooling system flush/bleed procedures and cross my fingers that this is the only problem.

I'll let you know how it goes, thanks for all your help!

Last edited by JJerrell; 07-14-2016 at 05:41 PM.
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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-18-2016, 01:28 PM Thread Starter
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That did it, changed the water outlet housing and flushed the cooling system. Drove her to work today and it was flawless! I guess the water pump still has a little life left after all (knock-on-wood). I'll keep an eye on it and get the correct water pump and timing chain assembly OEM instead of evergreen.

Thanks for all your help! I'll post pics of the damage to the old outlet housing if I remember when I get home and if anyone is interested
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