intake/exhaust timing marks? - DodgeIntrepid.Net Forums - Dodge Intrepid, Concorde, 300m and Eagle Vision chat
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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-29-2016, 04:13 PM Thread Starter
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intake/exhaust timing marks?

Hello folks boy how to start this off, well I changed the water pump on my dodge last year tried cleaning the sludge from the valves and you can guess what happened after that, bearing thrown scored journal etc. All of that repaired I put the cars timing on all the places that are marked started the bent the valves this time I don't want to bend the valves so I need to know specifically because I lack the comprehension apparently to follow the FSM! What I absolutely need to know is on the 99dodge intrepid 2.7 vinR the left hand side intake/exhaust cam secondary timing are the marks the triangles or the dots? Also when trying to bolt the main timing chain sprocket on the cam it flips over then I can line holes up easier. Why I went this far into the car was to replace the rod and bearing so heads came off FSM says to line up right cams to dots with 12 link pins between. I read somewhere that when replacing the cam on left side too make sure they float in their cradles did all that so the valves stayed closed then like I said lined up to the dots on the left hand side of the intake/exhaust camshafts and it flipped over while trying to line up bolt holes, which moved the dots from 12 o'clock to 2 o'clock I think. Take pics in the morning to show what happened. Holes lined up if turned counter clockwise noticed also that intake valve above piston #6 and exhaust valve above piston #2 is partially opened after doing this is that right? I do have compression checked it by putting wads of paper towels in spark plug holes hand cranking and watching them pop out shouldn't that be a sign that the timing is right? And no valves are contacting the heads? Anyway are the triangles or the dots on the drivers side intake/exhaust camshaft the timing marks for my year make and vin can anybody help me with this!!!!!
The firing order is:
5-6
3-4
1-2
Standing in front facing the engine

Last edited by jim61; 09-29-2016 at 11:32 PM. Reason: not enough info
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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 06:27 AM Thread Starter
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Wow folks 30+ views and not one comment does that mean I am okay or do I need the pictures for real? Just asking please say something even if it's "you're an idiot" Lol
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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 07:47 AM
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This:





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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 08:33 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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This:





Thanks for responding

Yup did this went by dots on drivers side but as stated when lining up camshafts with main timing chain left hand cam sprocket it flipped over moving the dots so they are not 90 from head surfaces also I can rotate crank by hand without it getting stopped does that indicate there will never be contact made between pistons and valves? Left camshaft sprockets show little arrow on both sprockets pointing at 11o'clock and dots @ 2 o'clock is hand cranking indicative of no problems image is from another site using for reference raining in my state can't get pic right now but since the flip this is the place that my cams are at now after it flipped is this cool? because of flip after putting colored inks on dots does it matter that it flipped?

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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 08:57 AM Thread Starter
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Okay this is my car did real quick in between rain drops this position is it right
so based on image 116 this is not right should b 2 o'clock not 1o'clock looking I also see that the bolts don't line up like in the picture

Last edited by jim61; 09-30-2016 at 10:23 AM.
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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 11:41 AM Thread Starter
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OK cool I see now that I have been over looking a few things so truth is the dots are the right ones for both camshafts and the arrows are probably for like the Chrysler 300 or even the 3.5 might have same type camshafts. So my having that on point and 12 links it's right but I will remove timing chain left camshaft again double-check links make sure that it's truly right, now other question, is intake valve above piston #6 and exhaust valve above piston #2 supposed to be slightly open because I beliefs that piston 1_2/ 4_5 are 60atdc and 3_6 are btdc is that also correct if so I can clean real good and button up Wow forever over thinking, this looks right!!!!!! my marks are at 90's from head surfaces

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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 12:25 PM
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Regarding cam flipping, with the crank mark lined up to the mark on the oil pump, no. 1 piston is at 60ATDC. This puts 1 and 4 at 60 ATDC, 2 and 5 at 60 BTDC, and 3 and 6 at BDC. At those piston positions, the valves do not come anywhere near touching any pistons even when full open, so you are free to rotate camshafts completely with crankshaft mark lined up.
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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 12:32 PM
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Just so there's no mis-understanding, BDC = bottom dead center, i.e., at bottom of stroke.
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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 06:16 PM Thread Starter
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Regarding cam flipping, with the crank mark lined up to the mark on the oil pump, no. 1 piston is at 60ATDC. This puts 1 and 4 at 60 ATDC, 2 and 5 at 60 BTDC, and 3 and 6 at BDC. At those piston positions, the valves do not come anywhere near touching any pistons even when full open, so you are free to rotate camshafts completely with crankshaft mark lined up.
So looking at my pics I am good to start just so I am sure and thank you for reassuring response
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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 08:02 PM
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Okay this is my car did real quick in between rain drops this position is it right
so based on image 116 this is not right should b 2 o'clock not 1o'clock looking I also see that the bolts don't line up like in the picture
Has the engine been rotated after setting up and installing the chain?

If not, the problem I see here is no "gold" links lined up with the arrow on the main sprocket; and/or on the dots on the secondary chain sprocket. Your main sprocket also appears to be in the incorrect position. On the secondary chains there are also darkened or gold links that act as the timing marks on the chain itself. These MUST line up with the dots on the camshaft gears (OR there must be 12 chain link pins between your dots on the secondary sprockets).

Just wanting to make sure you have the "gold" links in the chains lined up as pictured in the FSM pic that PEVA posted. They act as timing marks on the chain between the crank and two cams; along with those on the gears. They MUST be lined up correctly.

There is not much to it, if the different colored chain links are lined up with the correct dots/triangles on the camshaft sprockets and the crankshaft timing mark is lined up with the chain link, and sprocket and arrow on the oil pump housing, you will be good to go. DO NOT rotate the engine until the tensioner is reset, installed, and released. If you do, this will also screw up your timing. The chain is still loose enough at this point to easily jump a timing mark. Not sure if you did this either.

There is no need to worry about cylinder positions or valves being open, because if you follow the correct instructions, all that will be in place as it should be. From what I've seen and read here it sounds as if you have timed your secondary chains correctly and your primary chain incorrectly.

See my thread here:
2.7 Water Pump Replacement Procedure
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Last edited by Daytrepper; 09-30-2016 at 08:30 PM.
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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-30-2016, 11:25 PM Thread Starter
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[quote=Daytrepper;4035785]Has the engine been rotated after setting up and installing the chain?

If not, the problem I see here is no "gold" links lined up with the arrow on the main sprocket; and/or on the dots on the secondary chain sprocket. Your main sprocket also appears to be in the incorrect position. On the secondary chains there are also darkened or gold links that act as the timing marks on the chain itself. These MUST line up with the dots on the camshaft gears (OR there must be 12 chain link pins between your dots on the secondary sprockets).

Just wanting to make sure you have the "gold" links in the chains lined up as pictured in the FSM pic that PEVA posted. They act as timing marks on the chain between the crank and two cams; along with those on the gears. They MUST be lined up correctly.

There is not much to it, if the different colored chain links are lined up with the correct dots/triangles on the camshaft sprockets and the crankshaft timing mark is lined up with the chain link, and sprocket and arrow on the oil pump housing, you will be good to go. DO NOT rotate the engine until the tensioner is reset, installed, and released. If you do, this will also screw up your timing. The chain is still loose enough at this point to easily jump a timing mark. Not sure if you did this either.

There is no need to worry about cylinder positions or valves being open, because if you follow the correct instructions, all that will be in place as it should be. From what I've seen and read here it sounds as if you have timed your secondary chains correctly and your primary chain incorrectly.

Yep it's been rotated that's why you don't see gold links and I guess because I had tissues pop out the spark plug holes there's compression valves didn't contact pistons I'm good!! like I said I just don't want to have to do it again another member said same as you as far as any contact being made to pistons once timing on crank sprocket is lined up So camshafts good and I can close it up!?
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 10-01-2016, 10:08 AM Thread Starter
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Daytrepper OK back with update this morning I went out and took valve covers off and timing cover off to check timing these are the pics things look lined up right!!! Couple duplicates here my bad! But cams lined up right side looks 90 from floor and left side at 2 what you think?

Last edited by jim61; 10-01-2016 at 10:33 AM.
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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 10-01-2016, 03:43 PM
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things look lined up right!!! Couple duplicates here my bad! But cams lined up right side looks 90 from floor and left side at 2 what you think?
LOOKS right from here but if you are unsure remove the chain and re-time it.

You will have to rotate it several times to get the gold links to line back up. You could check it that way as well.
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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 10-01-2016, 04:41 PM
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LOOKS right from here but if you are unsure remove the chain and re-time it.

You will have to rotate it several times to get the gold links to line back up. You could check it that way as well.
According to DalPaul here (post 76): Reviving a 2.7
it takes 7 rotations of cams (which would of course be 14 rotations of the crank) to walk the gold links back to home position.

(search tags to find this info. again: rotations revolutions revs gold links chain crank cams camshafts walk)
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 10-01-2016, 08:07 PM Thread Starter
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What I did and hope it's good enough, I rotated the timing chain and #1 piston to 60ATDC watched my straw drop as the Grove in crankshaft sprocket lined up when it did the right intake/exhaust lined up like the images as well as the left hand side and I knew after having done it for awhile!!!!! That I had the marks matched to all colored links(I used blue and red marker) I just finished putting it all back together and battery is on charger give you a rundown tomorrow tried starting it tried to start but battery only had 11v showing
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