3.2 Timing Belt Replacement - DodgeIntrepid.Net Forums - Dodge Intrepid, Concorde, 300m and Eagle Vision chat
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post #1 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-07-2010, 10:45 PM Thread Starter
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3.2 Timing Belt Replacement

So, with 235K on my 2000 Intrepid, I figure it's time to change the timing belt and water pump. Done a fair amount of back yard mechanic work on it over the past year or so...new belts, change the steering rack, new radiator, new half-shaft & bearing hub..so I figure I can tackle the timing belt change. However, since every job I take on, I'm doing it for the first time, there are always things that I wish I had known before I started. So I'm trying to avoid that if possible with the timing belt job.

I have the FSM, so I can follow that pretty well. But does anyone have any tips to make the job go easier, or things to do to avoid problems. I worry a bit about screwing up the timing on the sprockets. Also, I thought I saw somewhere in the forum that I could get away without pulling the crankshaft pulley...not sure if that is accurate or not.

If anyone has advice, or can point me to another post/thread, that would be great!!

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post #2 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-08-2010, 12:07 AM
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I believe there's a how to here somewhere... pretty straightforward... Pull the radiator+fan+belts+tensioner+timing cover... rotate the engine to TDC... Remove the tensioner, remove the belt, remove the tensioner pulley, remove the water pump. Reinstall water pump, reinstall belt, reinstall tensioner pulley, reinstall hydraulic tensioner. Note you don't actually have to compress the tensioner. THe bolts are long enough to install the tensioner with the pin extended. Just go slow and go evenly between the two bolts. After the belt is on, rotate engine a few times to make sure everything is still lined up. Then zip up and you're good to go.

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post #3 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-08-2010, 12:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yiranhu View Post
Note you don't actually have to compress the tensioner. THe bolts are long enough to install the tensioner with the pin extended. Just go slow and go evenly between the two bolts. After the belt is on, rotate engine a few times to make sure everything is still lined up. Then zip up and you're good to go.
You absolutely should compress the tensioner and use the holding tool the proper way. That method of forcing it in with the bolts is NOT the correct way to do it!! You risk damaging the tensioner, and/or belt, and stripping out the bolt holes!!

The tensioner should be removed, placed in a vice, and compressed, then the holding pin installed, and the pin removed once the belt is installed, and light manual tension is applied to it.
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post #4 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 10:18 PM Thread Starter
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Advance Auto carries Dayco belts for @46 and a Conti Tech/Continental for $68. Other than the obvious price difference, does anyone have any feedback on on either of these brands?

Also, while I have it open, is it worthwhile to change the front crankshaft seal? The FSM says you need a special tool to get the old one out, and a different tool to set the new one in (just looks like a big socket), and yet a different tool to replace the crankshaft sprocket to the correct depth. Seems like a big headache, unless it looks like it is leaking.
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post #5 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 10:21 PM
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My Daddy always said, "If it aint broke , dont fix it", ive never see a front seal,, or the cam seals leak on a second gen 3.2/5, so , dont go pulling the cam sprockets off,
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post #6 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 10:21 PM
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use the dayco belt, its made by Gates
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post #7 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 10:23 PM
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and do what Dan says with the tensioner, compress it,
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post #8 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 10:26 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDodge View Post
My Daddy always said, "If it aint broke , dont fix it", ive never see a front seal,, or the cam seals leak on a second gen 3.2/5, so , dont go pulling the cam sprockets off,
Believe me, there was no way I was gonna f... with the cam sprockets!!!

I will take your advice and leave well enough alone...thanks!
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post #9 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-10-2010, 10:35 PM Thread Starter
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and do what Dan says with the tensioner, compress it,
Yeah, I'm planning to compress the plunger. I have a bench vise, and it sounds like that'll to the trick.

What about locking down the cams? I saw somewhere else in the forum to use an oversize back cover bolt and a piece of hose to lock them down. Don't want to go nuts, but I don't want the cams spinning on me when I am threading on the new belt.

Also, when I thread the new belt, should I keep the cam sprockets dead center between the marks? Or will they move a little when I re-install the tensioner and the belt tightens?

Thanks!!
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post #10 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronbiggs View Post
Yeah, I'm planning to compress the plunger. I have a bench vise, and it sounds like that'll to the trick.

What about locking down the cams? I saw somewhere else in the forum to use an oversize back cover bolt and a piece of hose to lock them down. Don't want to go nuts, but I don't want the cams spinning on me when I am threading on the new belt.

Also, when I thread the new belt, should I keep the cam sprockets dead center between the marks? Or will they move a little when I re-install the tensioner and the belt tightens?

Thanks!!
Cams aren't going to go anywhere during the belt install - not far enough to cause a problem, at least. They don't free-wheel too easily once the old belt is off.

You may end up with the dots dead-center when you get the new belt on, or maybe a bit off. As long as both sides are between the dots, you'll be A-OK.
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post #11 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 08:33 AM
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Cams aren't going to go anywhere during the belt install - not far enough to cause a problem, at least. They don't free-wheel too easily once the old belt is off.
Actually the cam will flip on you - no damage, but a PITA. That's why you lock it.

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You may end up with the dots dead-center when you get the new belt on, or maybe a bit off. As long as both sides are between the dots, you'll be A-OK.
I think that Ross disagrees with that. I thought he said you can end up with an either-or situation on one tooth difference, and it matters which one you choose - poor or no running one way, good running the other way.
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post #12 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 09:27 AM
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Actually the cam will flip on you - no damage, but a PITA. That's why you lock it.
Well I've done all of two in my life - and with both, I needed to to be able to "wiggle" the cams just a smidge in order to get the belt on and everything aligned where I liked it. I guess the first time one does swing around on me I'll change my ways.

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I think that Ross disagrees with that. I thought he said you can end up with an either-or situation on one tooth difference, and it matters which one you choose - poor or no running one way, good running the other way.
I had this happen to me on the Trep last year - was off a tooth and it ran, but poorly. When one side was dead center, other side was outside of the index dots. When corrected, one side was centered, the other was biased towards the inner dot a bit, but inside. Ran great then! This month my LHS ended up in the same situation, one side centered, other slightly to the inside.

Of course, IANAM (I Am Not A Mechanic), and YMMV.
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post #13 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 11:53 AM
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Actually the cam will flip on you - no damage, but a PITA. That's why you lock it.

I think that Ross disagrees with that. I thought he said you can end up with an either-or situation on one tooth difference, and it matters which one you choose - poor or no running one way, good running the other way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBigE View Post
Well I've done all of two in my life - and with both, I needed to to be able to "wiggle" the cams just a smidge in order to get the belt on and everything aligned where I liked it. I guess the first time one does swing around on me I'll change my ways.


I had this happen to me on the Trep last year - was off a tooth and it ran, but poorly. When one side was dead center, other side was outside of the index dots. When corrected, one side was centered, the other was biased towards the inner dot a bit, but inside. Ran great then! This month my LHS ended up in the same situation, one side centered, other slightly to the inside.

Of course, IANAM (I Am Not A Mechanic), and YMMV.
Again, if as long as your in the dot range, your fine. Going outside of the dots with one cam or the other, or being one tooth off, will cause rough running. Being inside the dots is the sweet spot. Never an issue in probably more than 200 timing belt swaps.
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post #14 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-12-2010, 08:13 AM
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Ross recommends biasing the passenger side cam to the choice that will put the sprocket mark closer to the dot on the right - see post no. 4 here: 3.5 cam timing marks

I have seen recommendations from others for the same. I was thinking I had seen posts where people were having problems with the engine not running well after a belt change, and the solution turned out to be to move the passenger side cam to accomplish what Ross said and that that fixed it. There are generally not problems with the driver's side cam because that is less subject to accumulated belt pitch error (closest to the crank sprocket) - and that is very likely the reason they put the cam position sensor on that sprocket (affecting and effecting ignition timing accuracy). If *that* one were off a tooth, that would have more serious effects - and would be considered an error on the part of the installer.


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post #15 of 31 (permalink) Old 06-12-2010, 01:34 PM Thread Starter
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So I started the Timing Belt job this morning. Made pretty good progress. The cooling fan was a pain in the butt 'cause one of the bottom retaining nuts was just spinning around in the plastic housing. Eventually got that off and things proceeded pretty well from there. Got the covers off and removed the tensioner plunger, and then it started to pour (damn forecast said possible showers late in the day!!!).

Anyway I compressed the plunger & took off the tensioner pulley. Can't get it off the housing so I called NAPA and they have a replacement that included the housing so I'm gonna run down there with my daughter's car.
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