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: LX why only rwd ?


skoczek
05-28-2004, 02:36 PM
I guess that's my question

Why is the LX only RWD ?


the lhs was RWD or FWD

why couldn';t they have made an LHS II that was both RWD and FWD


a single line that could do either , changing monthly as demand was placed on each type ?

is the mighty MB not able to do FWD ? :alien:

340duster
05-28-2004, 02:37 PM
awd will come next year...mb has never used FWD in case you havent noticed and do you know what kind of hell a line like that would cause for the aftermarket...i vote that line plan idea of the century

DMAG
05-28-2004, 02:46 PM
Originally posted by skoczek
I guess that's my question

Why is the LX only RWD ?


the lhs was RWD or FWD



The LHS was RWD? On what planet? :crazy:

The LX's get AWD this fall which gives them two options over the LHS's one option of FWD.

340duster
05-28-2004, 02:52 PM
damn i didnt even notice that....the LH was NEVER RWD...it could have been if the market demanded it that way, but it never did, so it wasnt

Gorm
05-28-2004, 02:55 PM
From what YB and Don have been telling me, the Transmission on the second LH can be converted to make the car rear wheel drive, I'm not sure how or what that all involves. I think i smell someones next mod. ;)


--Gorm

DMAG
05-28-2004, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by gormo66
From what YB and Don have been telling me, the Transmission on the second LH can be converted to make the car rear wheel drive, I'm not sure how or what that all involves. I think i smell someones next mod. ;)


--Gorm

We've been talking about that for years on this board. Noone has stepped up yet. :(

skoczek
05-28-2004, 03:15 PM
Dodge could a changed the LHS line to rwd in about a day's work from what I 've heard ,

but the lhs was too popular as fwd so they did not...

Imagine what LHSII coulda been .......:blush:

just cause MB can't do fwd does not mean that the option should been thrown out..... maybe they think the idea is to citroen

it only makes sense to cover all your options.......:wink:

btW the Avenger concept does the rwd thing with the 4 speed tranny.

340duster
05-28-2004, 03:23 PM
the LXs have the same trans as the intrepid in a RWD form...so did the prowler..

skoczek
05-28-2004, 03:27 PM
yah only the hemi has the 5 speed

hmmmmm

wonder if you could have a fwd in a 300c+1/2

then i'd think about gettin one .........

naaaaaaa it's not lhsII or ( fwd ready )

skoczek
05-28-2004, 03:34 PM
hmmmmmmmmmm

i did see an old intrepid , in fact 2 at the mianissansaturn dealer for sale at

only 3 g's each a 93 olive green 3.5 and a white 3.3 ..

convert one to rear wheel for fun hmm

hafta wait for the 300 though

can convert to fwd darn.....

340duster
05-28-2004, 03:35 PM
why the hell would you want FWD with all the electronics on the LX...there will be no winter problems with those cars
not to mention...fwd sucks

DMAG
05-28-2004, 03:41 PM
I can't understand the passion for FWD? You'd actually want to convert a RWD to FWD?

skoczek
05-28-2004, 07:59 PM
Ever driven in 4 feet of snow ---- 4 days in a row


and you'll quickly now why


rwd sucks in snow

DMAG
05-28-2004, 08:06 PM
I've driven RWD in every winter I lived in MI. Plenty of multi-foot snow storms. No problems in my Mustang, Fiero or pickups. Alot of it has to do with knowing how to drive and not just pressing the accelerator.

intrepitor
05-28-2004, 08:41 PM
Originally posted by 340duster
the LXs have the same trans as the intrepid in a RWD form...so did the prowler.. Actually the Prowler uses the same trans as the LH models do, it's just mounted in the back. The drive shaft is always spinning at whatever RPM the engine is spinning at. The trans that the LX uses is the RLE42 which is used on one of the Jeep models. I would love to convert my Trep to RWD but a couple of things are holding me back, front suspension and back suspension. The tranny is the easy part.

dakotaquadsport
05-28-2004, 09:57 PM
Originally posted by skoczek
Ever driven in 4 feet of snow ---- 4 days in a row


and you'll quickly now why


rwd sucks in snow

With the modern technology that is on these cars it will do good in the snow. I doubt that a FWD will get through 4 feet of snow at all, they sit too low, I know my Trep can barely make it through 2 feet but that's all I've gone though.

IntrepidXJ
05-28-2004, 09:58 PM
they made them rwd so you can do donuts easier. duh.

IntrepidXJ
05-28-2004, 10:00 PM
Originally posted by skoczek
Ever driven in 4 feet of snow ---- 4 days in a row


and you'll quickly now why


rwd sucks in snow


[Homer Simpson]......That name again, is Mr. PLOW![/Homer Simpson]

skoczek
05-31-2004, 11:53 AM
:baaa:

skoczek
05-31-2004, 11:57 AM
oops

skoczek
05-31-2004, 11:59 AM
from the winter snow driving I've done fwd is the easyiest most effective (inexpensive) way to get through the stuff

FWD --- A true life saver

now

Imagine if someone said that performance (defined as brute horsepower to the rear wheels) in a race car could be from a fwd NASCAR with some electronic do dadas added (I don't think so)

Sure for a race track or, no winter environemts rwd may be better , an oval track that turns left all the time or a straight super highway ,


but when it comes to real (manly) snow, weather-- the most effective way to traverse it is fwd

unless you enjoy getting stuck in the white icey stuff all the time

I've gone places in my fwd 4 cylinder dodge lancer that 287 v8 couldn't , wouldn't,

rwd could not even dare to tread but were stuck (like propelerless boats in the water..) and don't tell me that a good drivers can power his boat along with a propeller !!

just my experience taklin...:baaa:

94IntrepidES
06-13-2004, 01:29 AM
Here is an amazing idea, you could buy an AWD LX and I'm going out on a limb here it just might do better in the snow then any of your fwd cars and I bet better then just a rwd one too, just maybe....

Also who in their right mind would want to buy a chrysler with a hemi fwd only after freaking little 3.5 v6's ate the tranny all the time anyway.


Oh one more thing, FWD sucks ass.

Lafrad
06-13-2004, 10:53 AM
I will chuckle at this post for awhile...

You are comparing your light, small, compact lancer (a manly vehicle), with All season (or winter) tires, to any V8 car you have ever delt with? With skinny radials, stiff suspension, and a brute of a motor?

The only reason FWD has been so "safe" in the snow is because of the trend of "weight distrobution" and driver knowledge. It just so happens that most FWD vehicles are SO heavy over the front, that the wheels can just drag the rest of the car along. The DOES cause problems in the snow though too. You ever try driving up a moderate hill and trying to turn a little bit? yea, it doesn't happen. The same reason why racers don't use FWD: you only have 2 tires doing ALL of the work. they have to push the car forward, AND turn the car, with the same 2 squares of rubber.

Now.. switch to an electronically controlled traction control system, on a throttle by wire vehicle, Good all season/Snow tires, and lots of gears to get the right amount of torque. (not to mention a proper weight distrobution).

These LX's will be GREAT in the snow. The have a good amount of weight over each pair of tires (read, less plowing through corners) and the ride will feel better (with a traction control system that atcually works... unlike any LH platform car).

I know from experiance, that a RWD Conversion van with good all seson tires can go to the store and back in more snow and ice than my intrepid can with all season tires.

I also know that I have seen Mercedes SLK's on the road with snow tires that could handle ANY crap weather better than ANY car I have driven. (Snow tires make any car a good winter car). You are only missing a propeller if you can't get traction. You have plenty of traction with good tires. no matter what wheels drive

Originally posted by skoczek
from the winter snow driving I've done fwd is the easyiest most effective (inexpensive) way to get through the stuff

FWD --- A true life saver

now

Imagine if someone said that performance (defined as brute horsepower to the rear wheels) in a race car could be from a fwd NASCAR with some electronic do dadas added (I don't think so)

Sure for a race track or, no winter environemts rwd may be better , an oval track that turns left all the time or a straight super highway ,


but when it comes to real (manly) snow, weather-- the most effective way to traverse it is fwd

unless you enjoy getting stuck in the white icey stuff all the time

I've gone places in my fwd 4 cylinder dodge lancer that 287 v8 couldn't , wouldn't,

rwd could not even dare to tread but were stuck (like propelerless boats in the water..) and don't tell me that a good drivers can power his boat along with a propeller !!

just my experience taklin...:baaa:

Lafrad
06-13-2004, 10:59 AM
here... just for reference... How about a SPORTS car in the winter? something with stiff suspension and a high power to weight ratio:
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13623

the LX will defiantely be better than an RX-8 in winter... and those crazy canucks drive rx-8's all the time in the white stuff...

insane driver
06-13-2004, 10:25 PM
What the hell is mb?

dakotaquadsport
06-13-2004, 10:29 PM
Originally posted by insane driver
What the hell is mb?


Mercedes Benz....?

Dunno where you quoted that from so....That's my guess.

MikeW
06-15-2004, 11:29 PM
Rear wheel drive are superior cars.
Rear drive has a positive feedback traction advantage, front drive has a negative feedback traction loss (self limiting).
Rear drive cars have a better front to rear sprung to unsprung weight ratio. Watch a front drive car go over a bumpy road, the rear is thrown arount (almost uncontrollably)
Rear wheel drive cars are harder to make, a bad front wheel drive car is a mild annoyance, a bad rear drive car will get you killed. So rear wheel drive cars have to have a better pedigree. BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari.

Since rear drive cars have a more balanced F/R weight distribution, the tire pressure is lower than FWD cars, and this is part of the historical reason that RWD is regarded as inferior in winter (Dumbass owners didn't raise tire pressure on the early all season tires for winter duty)
My neighbor just got a 2005 C230K, recommended tire pressure for autobahn duty is 29 F, 32 R with 225/45 17 and 245/40 17 rear (both they(MB)are afraid of oversteer with novice drivers) Winter tire recommendations are 205/50 17 and 225/45 17 rear 34, 37 psi

skoczek
06-18-2004, 09:09 AM
Do autobahns have any turns in them ?

rwd was always been used for drag racers and cars that only turn left in racing .....

fwd had the Manly task of rally racing where the simplicity and ability to dedicate itself to the task of driving makes fwd a winner .....
except for a few astronomically expensive awd cars

then again maybe Mercedes engineeres are limited in their understanding of anything other than rwd
---- sorta a quick and easy engineer way (rwd) to make a car ,
then let marketing bull inist that it is superior (hahaha) :cry:

by the flawed logic that a few black boxes can change basic characteristics and make a rwd car is just as good as FWD in snow is tooooo much

do you know what snow is ?
have you ever really driven in it?
put your life on the line in -45C weather?
with 3 feet o snow and a pack o kids in the car?

(remeber rwd --- go straight or just turn left only ?)

probably not , not a real world person ? yaaa well

Operator
06-18-2004, 10:53 AM
FWD was pushed to make driving easier for idiots and manufacturing easier for car companies. FWD being common in rally racing is NOT because it has superior driving characteristics (it doesn't). It's for the same reason why so many people's toys for SCCA club type slalom racing are FWD....they're cheap and plentiful cars to make into a cheap easily maintained racecar with plenty of spare parts in the junkyards. You cannot balance a FWD vehicle correctly. If you're trying to argue FWD is better for handling, you couldn't be more wrong. I guess all those engineers from Mercedes, BMW, Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborghini, Saleen, etc. must just not understand that FWD is better.


Besides, you can't do things like THIS (http://216.234.186.186/video-007.mpeg) in a FWD.

E8502
06-19-2004, 01:06 PM
If you can't drive a RWD car in the snow, you shouldn't be driving. If you are a good driver, you can push a RWD car through the snow better then a FWD. My LHS for example, really stinks in the snow, and often, my mothers Lexus (RWD) is better in the fluffy white stuff.

skoczek
06-25-2004, 03:46 PM
Oyyyy this is toooo easy !!!!!!




:bigsmile:

My LHS for example, really stinks in the snow, and often, my mothers Lexus (RWD) is better in the fluffy white stuff.

So your mother (and granny ) drive better than you ? ???!!!!


:crazy: :wink: figures :mg: :mg:

340duster
06-25-2004, 03:49 PM
he never said anything about the driver...why is it that with every post you seem more and more like a troll?

even after having you denied by other people who live in snowy areas and drive RWD cars in the snow, you continue to say that its impossible...i have no knowledge on this, since i live in Florida...but i would trust DMAG and the others any day...and last time i checked...-45 degree snow is the same as 0 degree or 15 degree snow...its all white and fluffy and winter tires make one hell of a difference...maybe you just need the FWD because YOU cant drive?

july2004
07-09-2004, 12:22 PM
actually being stuck in -45C or -45F weather for more than 30 minutes and your dead .....

ask some one whose been there .....

remeber the 73 vega with the all new tech aluminum engine with the new process for fightin wear.

my buddy bought one and had to get rid of it when after only 30 k miles the engine WORE OUT.

New tech to fight rwd problems in snow

put a black box in a dragster and tell me it can handle curves no way!!!

same with this

simple effective operation is best....
tricks don't work .... they break down when you needem most. :Eyecrazy:

dakotaquadsport
07-09-2004, 05:00 PM
Actually, we had a 77 Chevy Impala that did great in the snow, sure we would peg leg it for a few feet but she got up and went...250 motor was all original except for the waterpump....man that thing was good, I was sad to see it go :(

As for the autobahn having turns, yes it does. Ever see a BMW, all RWD cars and they are commonly called "The ultimate driving machine". ESP, Traction Control and ABS changed the car forever. Hell my Intrepid is FWD but still uses traction control in the snow because it slips and slides when trying to get up and go.

E8502
07-09-2004, 07:31 PM
Oyyyy this is toooo easy !!!!!!




:bigsmile:



So your mother (and granny ) drive better than you ? ???!!!!


:crazy: :wink: figures :mg: :mg:
No, I can drive fine thank you very much. My mom is also a good driver, and well, my granny is dead......

What I mean is if I were driving the LS430...

E8502
07-17-2004, 04:54 PM
Also, FYI, AWD info is now out.

july2004
07-20-2004, 10:18 AM
if rwd is so superior why did chrysler go bankrupt when all it offered was rwd ? :fun_48:

DMAG
07-20-2004, 10:39 AM
if rwd is so superior why did chrysler go bankrupt when all it offered was rwd ? :fun_48: They also offered (mostly) only carbureted engines. Is that why they almost went bankrupt?

The product stank, plain and simple. That's why they almost went bankrupt.

Mercedes and BMW only offer RWD vehicles and they seem to be doing just fine staying away from bankruptcy courts.

DjPiLL
07-20-2004, 01:53 PM
if rwd is so superior why did chrysler go bankrupt when all it offered was rwd ? :fun_48:

:loser:

340duster
07-20-2004, 01:57 PM
if rwd is so superior why did chrysler go bankrupt when all it offered was rwd ? :fun_48:
wow....you know whats really funny? trucks are only RWD and seem to be selling just fine

july2004
07-20-2004, 02:41 PM
tractors are rwd and have always sold fine

but I would not buy one to drive,

Why did chrysler turn to fwd in the early 80's if rwd is the way , ( the light and the truth ) ?

DMAG
07-20-2004, 02:55 PM
tractors are rwd and have always sold fine

but I would not buy one to drive,

Why did chrysler turn to fwd in the early 80's if rwd is the way , ( the light and the truth ) ?
Here's a good question...why do you post under two names...skoczek and july2004 ?

At least post from two different computers!

340duster
07-20-2004, 03:05 PM
Here's a good question...why do you post under two names...skoczek and july2004 ?

At least post from two different computers!

doh! owned by the IP addy

dont forget that this user was almost banned earlier for being an ass, much like now, but said that some kids "stole" the logon...:rolleyes:

sounds like a troll to me

edit: heres (http://www.dodgeintrepid.net/forums/showthread.php?t=35997&highlight=punk+rockers+stolen) the thread from before...slightly knocked down...but it used to be many mods threatening the account

dakotaquadsport
07-20-2004, 03:36 PM
Chrysler almost went bankrupt because like was mentioned before that the products stunk. Plain and simple. FWD was brought out because that is what the market was going for, thats why the Aerostar by Ford did not sell well at all compared to the Caravan, because the Caravan was FWD. With the modern technology that is now, RWD is more pratical than ever before. And basically the K car and the minivan saved the company, and with the introduction of the LH series, the Neon, they really saved the day. Now consumers are looking for performance, and Chrysler sees that RWD is the answer to put the most power to the ground.

july2004
07-20-2004, 03:48 PM
Awwww comon Steve .....

your loosing the argument even in your own mind even ,

thereby resorting to all sorts mud rakin bs personal attacks

you don't sound like someone with an open mind


your thoughts are so :LAME:

go drive your tractor :countdown

340duster
07-20-2004, 03:58 PM
loosing the argument in your own mind even ,

thereby resorting to all sorts personal attacks

you don't sound like someone with an open mind


so :LAME:

go drive your tractor :countdown
because you are the epitome of open mindedness, and RWD is still better for everything

E8502
07-20-2004, 08:49 PM
Here's a good question...why do you post under two names...skoczek and july2004 ?

At least post from two different computers!
That's awesome!

They often forget that mods and admins can view IP's!

july2004
07-22-2004, 11:41 AM
stick to the subject mud raker
ask the admins.

now answer me this Steve,

why do you support the use of large engined cars that suck a lot of gas?

this policy result in your buddies dying for oil (you burn so freely) in the middle east .....

your some kinda (nice guy ) patriot to your country,

remeber what chrysler said in the early 80's

if everyone owned a K car then the US would not have a gas crisis---- and all the death your (personaly), ignorantly support

:reap: :yousuck: justify that buddy boy

340duster
07-22-2004, 11:47 AM
stick to the subject mud raker
ask the admins.

now answer me this Steve,

why do you support the use of large engined cars that suck a lot of gas?

this policy result in your buddies dying for oil (you burn so freely) in the middle east .....

your some kinda (nice guy ) patriot to your country,

remeber what chrysler said in the early 80's

if everyone owned a K car then the US would not have a gas crisis---- and all the death your (personaly), ignorantly support

:reap: :yousuck: justify that buddy boy
because its fun...big engines mean big power...big power means big fun...its not my fault you cant afford gas to have fun with
/me goes to fill up my 12 mpg truck :beat:

adaptabl
07-22-2004, 02:09 PM
because its fun...big engines mean big power...big power means big fun...its not my fault you cant afford gas to have fun with
/me goes to fill up my 12 mpg truck :beat:


Besides. The U.S. can find another country to invade and occupy for oil if the prices get too high. If Kerry gets in there will soon be a big tax on gas gussler cars and trucks(that would be a good thing). $5.00 gallon gas would help also.

340duster
07-22-2004, 02:18 PM
Besides. The U.S. can find another country to invade and occupy for oil if the prices get too high. If Kerry gets in there will soon be a big tax on gas gussler cars and trucks(that would be a good thing). $5.00 gallon gas would help also.
and you would also have to pay a tax on that pig of an altima you drive
3.5L and only 26 mpg on the highway...come on...a 5.7 in the 4000 lb C gets 25, surely your wonderful company can fix that

dakotaquadsport
07-22-2004, 02:19 PM
Awwww comon Steve .....

your loosing the argument even in your own mind even ,

thereby resorting to all sorts mud rakin bs personal attacks

you don't sound like someone with an open mind


your thoughts are so :LAME:

go drive your tractor :countdown

What the hell are you talking about? And why are you referring to me?

popimp
09-03-2004, 04:31 PM
There is not enough room in the LH models to make it RWD dont even try it it is a waist of time

340duster
09-03-2004, 07:01 PM
There is not enough room in the LH models to make it RWD dont even try it it is a waist of time
the LH was designed to be switched from FWD to RWD at any time the market demanded it

dakotaquadsport
09-03-2004, 07:18 PM
the LH was designed to be switched from FWD to RWD at any time the market demanded it


and or AWD. :)

RJ
09-14-2004, 01:25 PM
tractors are rwd and have always sold fine

but I would not buy one to drive,

Why did chrysler turn to fwd in the early 80's if rwd is the way , ( the light and the truth ) ?

That's because of the oil crisis and a general downsizing of all cars in that time period.

When Chrysler offered all RWD cars, so did pretty much every body else. Find me a FWD Chevelle SS. And When Chrysler switched, that's also when Ford and GM switched to RWD.

Like others said, you don't see BMW and Mercedes going belly up.