The Croatian Needs some Intrepid Emmisons help ASAP!!!! - DodgeIntrepid.Net Forums - Dodge Intrepid, Concorde, 300m and Eagle Vision chat
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-22-2003, 05:42 PM Thread Starter
 
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Lightbulb The Croatian Needs some Intrepid Emmisons help ASAP!!!!

My good friend Gordan has a White 1996 Dodge Intrepid.
It has the High Output 3.5L V6 motor in it.

Well, as he went in for emmisons last week he failed.
Came over here and we did a Much needed tuneup that included new wires (Bosch), Bosch +4's, Air Filter, oil, etc.
Went in and thought that this might do the trick as it has in the past on previous cars.

Noppers:mad:

Ohh well.
My cousin is a salesman at a Local Dodge dealer here and we took a trip last night. Had him do me a favor and a mechanic hooked it up to check for the codes (beats paying $80.00 for a dianostics test ). No codes came up, and everything was just fine and peachy

I guess he says that it might be one of the cat's thats bad, and goes in well with the story that the emmisions place told us. I guess the 1996 and 1995 Intrepid did not have a feature that would throw the code for a faulty cat. I went under the car, and there are 3 cats. One per header and a joint cat where the downpipes meet. Is this a correct assumption?

My question is this:

Has anyone had this problem in the past?
If so, please help so we can do this.
ANY INFO IS MORE THAN GRATEFULL!

:blush:



Yes, I could search the site, but I dont have the time right now and it might be easier to as someone. Randy, you have any info for me?
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-22-2003, 06:11 PM
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There is indeed a code that will be thrown if a cat is bad. It will light if the catalyst efficiency is below an acceptable level.

Since the MIL didn't light, that may not be the problem. Bang on the cats to see if they are plugged or if they are broken up on the inside.

A few things I can suggest is to get rid of those Bosch plugs and get some Champion Gold's as the 3.5L heads tend to eat the platinum ones. (I assume the +4 are platinum.) Also, check and clean the IAC and inspect the EGR for proper operation.

If those aren't the culprit the 02 sensors may also be bad, sometimes they'll throw a code, sometimes they won't. :dozeoff:

If all that fails, tell him to move to Minnesota, where we don't have emissions testing.
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-22-2003, 06:12 PM
 
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What did he fail on.... hydrocarbons, carbon monoxide, NOx.... ? Knowing more about that can give you hints as to what is wrong.
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-22-2003, 06:21 PM Thread Starter
 
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He's comming here in a little while and I'll scan the report and you guys can use that as reference.
Thanks
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 12:57 AM
 
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Croat, a couple of things that might help.

1) go first thing in the morning, when the air is cooler. This helps to improve combustion.

2) make sure the motor has been up to operating temp for at least 30 mins.

3) put in 2 bottles of FI cleaner and run it steady for 30 mins (highway speed is good). This will help prevent pooling which can cause a hydrocarbon "Fail". Then fill with #4 below.

4) use low octane fuel. This has a lower temp for ignition, so you will burn it more completely. This will lower the hydrocarbon % and because of lower temps, will reduce the NOX.

5) TAP the EGR valve to make sure it doesn't stick.

6) punch a hole in all the cats and mufflers. That way half the exhaust never makes it to the sensors. (just kidding...I had to throw some humor in).

-- I have heard, but never tried, that if you pour in a bottle of Everclear in with your gas you will pass as you will be burning in part Alchohol, which won't produce hydrocarbons or NOX. I can't say if this will work, but as a last resort...

Hope this helps.
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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 01:36 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by LHSer
(I assume the +4 are platinum.)
They are. At our local Advance Auto Parts they sell a can of something that helps you to pass emissions. Supposedly it is guaranteed, but I don't know of anyone who's ever used it due to the fact that we don't have emissions testing here. Go figure...
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 09:41 AM Thread Starter
 
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Its not that the car is not passing the test, as they only hook up the computer to the harness under the dash. They dont hook anything up to the tailpipe at all.

The first thing they cay could be wrong is cylinder #6 is misfiring.

The other 2 posibilities are no activity from the O2 sensor (sensors) and another O2 sensor error.

The odd thing is that the car is not throwing any codes, the dealership test confirmed the O2 sensors are working, and nothing else has been running below normal. :crazy:
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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 09:47 AM
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The 02 sensors need to come up to operating temp before they are accurate.

But, they are pretty flaky on these cars, sometimes they'll throw codes, sometimes they won't.

If they've never been changed, I'd go ahead and do so anyway.
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 11:22 AM
 
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the O2 sensors can be bad enough to fail emissions tests and still not throw a code. I know this from experiance.
Replace the 4 O2 sensors.. (order them from the internet if you can.. they are stupidly expensive from local stores because the plugs are all different). he will probably get a couple of MPG's in the process.
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 11:23 AM Thread Starter
 
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True, but easier said than done.
If we go and replace the 4 (im assuming thats how many there are) O2 sensors and it still fails, we just spent alot of money on something that was unneeded. Also, why change all 4 when only one could be bad!

Any way to troubleshoot and see if the O2 sensor is working?
Still in limbo here:dozeoff:
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 11:35 AM
 
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you live in milwaukee and they hook up a computer to the car? thats a new one to me. I used to go through emissions tests in Waukesha county.. and it is always the Fart-Pipe test. they drive in, put the car on the dyno, hook up a tube to your exhaust, and get in and drive. (I haven't been to one in a couple years tho, as my primary residence is in Eau CLaire,.. where we don't have testing.)

If the car is failing a computer based test (I have never seen that), then whatever they see should be seen by the dealer too. their scan tool is just as advanced as the emissions place.
a cylender misfire might be attributed to the infamous Intake manifold gasget problem... so you might have to replace that.
how many miles does he have on the car?
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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 02:45 PM Thread Starter
 
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The car has 110,000 miles and it has a re-built motor. There is oil leaking onto the spark plugs, and I was thinking that was a shibby valve cover gasket.

The emmisions place in Milwaukee said it failed, and those were possible reasons why it failed. The dealer said the computer dianostics showed nothing, and the mechanic said it could be a faulty cat. I have no idea what I should try first.

Money is a huge factor as he's normaly broke, and this trial and error thing can get very costly!
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 03:37 PM
 
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wait. so explain this again. he goes to get it tested for emissions...... they plug it into their little tester. it fails.
he takes the car to the dealer.. they find nothing wrong.
is that the case?

(no exhaust pipe tests are run?)
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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 04:13 PM Thread Starter
 
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Yes, you are correct.
They dont do the tailpipe test.

Dealer says no codes at all, are on.
To top that off, he says that cylinder 6 is not misfiring.
The DMV says otherwise, and he needs to pass emmisions.

How much for all new O2 sensors, and who has a link?
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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 05-23-2003, 04:22 PM
 
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how many times has he been to emissions?
have you replaced the Camshaft sensor? (it is cheap and easy to get to).
something sounds fishy with the way either the dealer or the emissions place is checking
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