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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-13-2018, 03:53 PM Thread Starter
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Injector leaking...

I knew I should have replaced those o-rings when I did my valve covers, but I forgot and bolted it all back up.

I figured shit, I'll just get the dealer to do it and they want me to pay a $150 diagnostic fee to even check if that is the case. Then said if it is due to the recall, they will not charge me. Are fuel injector o-rings covered in the recall, or only the fuel rail o-rings? The recall only mentions the fuel rail and its o-rings but I've heard others say the injector o-rings are also covered.

When the engine warms up, there is raw fuel coming from the #4 (I believe) injector (middle passenger side). Though the car runs and idles fine, seems pretty dangerous to have raw fuel sizzling on the engine.
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-13-2018, 04:37 PM
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Usually in a case like that everything is covered. I would check with the dealer to be sure.

I would not start it or drive it until it is fixed, that is a fire waiting to happen!
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-13-2018, 04:45 PM Thread Starter
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Getting the dealer to do anything is a pain in the ass. I called another dealer and they told me to call Chrysler customer service first because the recall fix was already performed in 1999.

I made an appointment with the first dealer I called for Monday and I'm not paying no $150 if they decide it has nothing to do with the recall. I'll report them to the feds.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-14-2018, 12:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codyj View Post
...When the engine warms up, there is raw fuel coming from the #4 (I believe) injector (middle passenger side)...
If passenger side, it would be #3. Odd numbers are on passenger side.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-14-2018, 01:24 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by peva View Post
If passenger side, it would be #3. Odd numbers are on passenger side.
Yep, you right. Thought odds were on driver's side for some reason.

I drove today pretty far and there was no leak. Doubt dealer is going to do anything if they can't reproduce the issue so I'll probably just do it myself.

I notice in the o-ring pack, there are two, a big yellow one (upper) and a small black one (lower). Does the yellow one seal the injector to the rail or is there a third o-ring in there?

Also, what's the purpose of the paper fuel rail gasket?
One got destroyed so I need to source new ones. Are they only available in the manifold gasket set or can I get them separately?
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-14-2018, 07:30 PM Thread Starter
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Judging by the pics in the FSM, seems the upper o-ring does go into the fuel rail. Makes sense.

Is there a way to clean the injectors while I have them out? Back flushing with brake cleaner? Probably shouldn't risk destroying them.
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-15-2018, 12:51 AM
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Originally Posted by codyj View Post
Judging by the pics in the FSM, seems the upper o-ring does go into the fuel rail. Makes sense.

Is there a way to clean the injectors while I have them out? Back flushing with brake cleaner? Probably shouldn't risk destroying them.
I’m thinking Sea Foam, Techroline, or Marvel Mystery Oil might chemically work better than brake parts cleaner on those particular types of deposits. Could also put a can of Sea Foam/Techroline/MMO in the fuel tank for both of the next two fillups, though undiluted on the bench (overnight soak plus bi-directional flow) might work more thoroughly for particularly stubborn deposits. Or do both bench and tank.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-15-2018, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codyj View Post
Getting the dealer to do anything is a pain in the ass. I called another dealer and they told me to call Chrysler customer service first because the recall fix was already performed in 1999.

I made an appointment with the first dealer I called for Monday and I'm not paying no $150 if they decide it has nothing to do with the recall. I'll report them to the feds.
So you expect them to look at your car for free; have a technician take some of it apart, and reassemble it, for nothing? Yet they have to pay that technican to do this. Also pay for the service writer to do the paperwork, plus the time and utilities in the shop.

It may very well have nothing to do with the recall because you dont seem to know all the details of the recall; or if the recall is already been done, which, if it was done in 1999 and problem solved, maybe the freaking Orings/gaskets/whatever are just worn out because its a 20+ year old car? How is that their fault? If it is in fact nothing to do with the recall, you will owe them their time and labor for whatever they did to it.


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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-15-2018, 11:34 AM Thread Starter
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So you expect them to look at your car for free; have a technician take some of it apart, and reassemble it, for nothing? Yet they have to pay that technican to do this. Also pay for the service writer to do the paperwork, plus the time and utilities in the shop.

It may very well have nothing to do with the recall because you dont seem to know all the details of the recall; or if the recall is already been done, which, if it was done in 1999 and problem solved, maybe the freaking Orings/gaskets/whatever are just worn out because its a 20+ year old car? How is that their fault? If it is in fact nothing to do with the recall, you will owe them their time and labor for whatever they did to it.
You're right. I'm just blowing off steam.

Even the dealer didn't know the details of the recall either, I asked them point-blank if the injector o-rings were covered since the parts are listed in the recall in the list of things to replace, but they didn't know. I do know safety recalls must be performed even if they were already done before, dealer did confirm that.

There is just a bit of gray area in the recall as it doesn't state the injector o-rings as the primary point of failure, but are listed in the required parts to replace only on the passenger side, where my leak is (lists 3 upper o-rings and 3 lower o-rings). I don't think it is worth the risk of $150 just to take my plenum off if they decide it isn't covered.

Link to the recall details:
https://testing-public.carmd.com/Tsb...0022dc80bc03b3

Last edited by codyj; 12-15-2018 at 11:37 AM.
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-15-2018, 12:23 PM
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You're right. I'm just blowing off steam.

Even the dealer didn't know the details of the recall either, I asked them point-blank if the injector o-rings were covered since the parts are listed in the recall in the list of things to replace, but they didn't know. I do know safety recalls must be performed even if they were already done before, dealer did confirm that.

There is just a bit of gray area in the recall as it doesn't state the injector o-rings as the primary point of failure, but are listed in the required parts to replace only on the passenger side, where my leak is (lists 3 upper o-rings and 3 lower o-rings). I don't think it is worth the risk of $150 just to take my plenum off if they decide it isn't covered.

Link to the recall details:
https://testing-public.carmd.com/Tsb...0022dc80bc03b3
I was hoping so. No worries. I work for a dealer and I know all the ins and outs of whats involved in these type of things especially on older vehicles. People dont seem to understand that if we have to work on your car for 2 hours just for you to take it home and not fix it, you just cost us a bunch of overhead for nothing. Plus if we take it apart and remove something with a gasket for diagnostic reasons then they dont fix it they want us to put it back together for free and pay for the gasket too. If I had a nickel. If its repaired the diagnostic fee is normally waived and calculated into the work time and becomes part of the job. Sometimes on a vehicle this old with a now unfamiliar recall the dealer needs to research it. So in your case if its covered the diag fee would be waived. But yes, you risk it not being covered and having to pay the $150 at the same time.

If I were you I'd replace all the orings in the fuel rail and injectors; take a good look at the injectors too, I've seen the bodies of them crack. You might have $100 in the job, if you have dealer do it, it moves the liability to them as well; but its going to cost more.


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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-19-2018, 09:19 PM
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I had a 95 or 96 LHS with a leaky fuel rail, which I took into the dealer. The dealer service guy said the car had already been fixed once on recall for that problem. I just said, maybe they didn't fix it right, but it needs fixing so fix it, I'll take care of the costs. When I came back to pick it up, they said it was covered under the recall, and it was no charge. Nice!
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-01-2019, 04:23 PM Thread Starter
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Finally got around to replacing the o-rings.

Just because the bracket holes line up doesn't mean it is seated correctly! Good thing I checked for leaks before putting it all back. Cylinder 6 leaked all over because the bracket wasn't pushed back enough. A bunch of fuel went down the cylinder when I reseated it so I sucked it out with a tube. Got some fuel in my mouth and didn't taste as bad as I thought. Kinda stood there waiting for the piss taste to take over but it was like an oily mouthwash.

Also I'm surprised only 1 cylinder was leaking. All except 1 injector had disintegrated seals, and the other had blue seals different from the others. Must have been a new injector as those seals were not as bad.

Need a beer now.
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-01-2019, 04:27 PM
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Mmmmmm.....fuel flavored beer!


So what's the verdict? All the leaks are fixed now?
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-01-2019, 04:36 PM Thread Starter
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Mmmmmm.....fuel flavored beer!


So what's the verdict? All the leaks are fixed now?
Yeah after re-seating the injector, I put the bracket on and put bolts in finger tight before pushing the bracket towards the #6 injector then tightened it down. No more leak.

Probably all for nothing if my tranny blows up soon though but at least I don't have to keep looking at the fire extinguisher in my passenger seat.
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-07-2019, 11:36 AM Thread Starter
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The car feels so smooth now after changing the injector seals... wow. Can't even tell the car is on at idle.
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