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post #1 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 12:32 AM Thread Starter
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E85 Conversion

Hey guys, the more i hear and find out about E85 ( 85% ethanol, 15% gasoline) fuel, the more it intrigues me. i heard that it is possible to do a conversion. but i was hoping maybe one of you out there were more informed than i was about this. from what i know, u need to make sure u have materials that ethanol (alcohol) wont deteriorate. also it burns at a higher rate than gasoline, so possibly new fuel injectors/ fuel pump needed, along with some kind of mod to the computer so that it will know how to set the fuel/air ratio. there are 2 kits out there called "flextech" and "flextune" and they have word for word copied descriptions of their products, under different names and company names. they claim to run out of brazil blah blah blah, system costs anywhere between 300 - 1000 fuck that, that cant be right. i found it is legal to convert the car, u just need to have the safety of the conversion investigated along with passing an annual emmisions test, but screw that, MN doesnt test anymore and they dont care.

the thing ive found about E85 tho, is that it is much cheaper in MN than everywhere else. we have 203 stations that carry E85 normally, most states dont carry more than 3! and in those states E85 costs more than gas. well shit. today in minnesota, in centerville for anyone local thats interested, 87 octane was 2.809, 89 octane was like 2.939, and 91 was like 3.109 per gallon. BUT, the thing that rele caught my attention, E85 was 2.219 per gallon!!!! holy shit! i did a search around MN and that price is pretty much the same all over. wow.

im too tired to talk more about it, im already rambling


but one more thing, for anyone who doesnt know, usually when people convert to E85 or buy an E85 compatible car, it is a "flexifuel" car or Bi-fuel car. so it can take pure gasoline, pure E85, or a mixture, and it will compensate. so that is what i rele like, use E85 locally, and when i travel, and E85 isnt available, get gas


so basically my main question is if n e one knows more about this fuel. and how easy a mod is, particularly on a 1995 intrepid ES.

thx guys
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post #2 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 12:41 AM
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wel you really don't have a choice the ethanol blend is out, and its gonig to be the way it is, just the ethanol blend is fine for liek every car, its the other one i forget what it is realyl but there is another blend and that is only for FFV
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post #3 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 12:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomyk89
today in minnesota, in centerville for anyone local thats interested, 87 octane was 2.809, 89 octane was like 2.939, and 91 was like 3.109 per gallon.


thx guys

Wow...only 2.809? I pay 3.06 average for regular.
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post #4 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 03:13 AM
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Just to let you know that if you ahve the 3.3 engine it shoudl be fles fuel if you hav ethe 3.5 you will have to buy a kit at least thats what I was told.
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post #5 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 12:15 PM
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that's incorrect^ only certain 3.3's came flex fuel enabled
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post #6 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 12:42 PM
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http://www.e85fuel.com/index.php has some info on what cars have been made that are flex fuel cars, ones that can use either regular gas or E85. As far as converting, you're looking at replacing the entire fuel system, tank right thru to injectors. Ethanol is more corrosive than gasoline so the components need to be able to withstand that. The fuel system on your ordinary car isn't up to snuff to handle that level of ethanol. Computer programming is another issue. E85 has a 105 octane rating to slow the burn. The pcm has to take this into account to burn it properly. On flex fule cars, there's a sensor in the tank to determine what kind of fuel is in there and it lets the pcm know, so it can use the correct programming.

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post #7 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kensher
you will have to buy a kit at least thats what I was told.
tough to buy something that doesn't exist. Right now, there si nothing developed to convert cars over to flex fuel or E85.
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post #8 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 02:02 PM
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Just as the news has said (and my own research), if you look at the cost of producing flex fuel, and all the other bull shit, by the time you buy it at the pump, it can be the same, or even MORE expensive then normal gas. Sure some places it will be cheaper, same thing with gas. My advice is dont waste your time on a retarded thing like E85, sure its cool that someone finally cares, but you know what, its just not worth it, if you want a cheaper solution get a hybrid or learn how to cut costs on normal gasoline, Flex-fuel is a gay attempt at saving money.

Sorry for the attitude, but I honestly think flex fuel is a waste of time money and thought process, there are better solutions, but the top companies are being assholes about it.

Durring the clinton administration, the president pushed for a vehicle to be made that got 99mpg, guess what? there was a prototype that was tested in japan that got, 99.5miles per gallon. Guess what else? we will NEVER see this vehicle produced because the oil companies and the car companies make too much money to give a rats ass about us, think how bad the gas companies would be hit if a car was released that got 99 miles to the gallon? You'd never buy gas.

All in all there are better solutions, so I really think this country should stop wasting its resources on something that will eventually fail.
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post #9 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 02:22 PM
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Well, Japy, you seem like pretty much every American, frustrated over current gas prices. While I think E85 may be a viable solution, I think you're dead on with it might end up costing more than it saves. For instance, its already documented that these flex fuel cars get lower MPG on E85 than gas. Its possible to actually spend more on E85 to go the same distance on gas.

But, just like most Americans, I think you and I are agreed that there needs to be an alternative to gasoline. A car running 99 MPG on gasoline is great but it still runs on gas, and still leaves some dependance on oil. At least ethanol has promise as a renewable source, where we don't get f**ked because of the global market. Ethanol might not be the end-all solution to getting off gasoline, it may be a good alternative to fill in the blank space between gas and whatever is better than ethanol. Hydrogen is technology being looked into. Not sure what else is out there, but gasoline has to go sooner or later.

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post #10 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 02:31 PM
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Just to state my frustrations, I'm actually not frustrated that much by the gas prices, you know there isnt anything we can do about it. With regards to how much I spend on gas I'm irritated about the small things in my own car that cause my MPG to drop like a rock (maintanence things and a shortage of funds) but I still stand firm when I say "My intrepid will get better gas milege then your honda"

Sometimes I have mood swings, I'm an angry person =( so don't mind my angry tone or attitude at times ^_^
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post #11 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Japy
"My intrepid will get better gas milege then your honda"

??? Not sure about that one. I guess it depends on which Honda, like a Passport maybe?
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post #12 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 05:38 PM
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will if the 8th digit on your vin is a T you have a reg gas 3.3L, If it is a U you are Flexfuel compatable. This site give all the factory flexfuel engines and how to read the vin's http://www.e85fuel.com/information/vin.php
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post #13 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 05:38 PM
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I thought that pretty much most cars can run ethanol blend with no problems. If there was a big issues with corrosion etc, then there would have to be major program just to get everyones cars converted over. If cars couldn't run on this stuff, it wouldn't be showing up all over the place.
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post #14 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gr8crash
I thought that pretty much most cars can run ethanol blend with no problems. If there was a big issues with corrosion etc, then there would have to be major program just to get everyones cars converted over. If cars couldn't run on this stuff, it wouldn't be showing up all over the place.
all cars can run on on a blend, up to a point. Once the % ethanol in the blend gets too much, it causes problems. Flex Fuel cars are capable of running 85% ethanol, regular cars cannot do that without having issues. Typically, regular gas is up to 10% ethanol. I think up here in the northeast, they go with 10% ethanol during the winter. Not too sure, but up to 10% is very common around the country.
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post #15 of 29 (permalink) Old 05-17-2006, 05:52 PM
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well we never had ethanol in this NE are until recent weeks. Just as most of the country as they chnge over to ethanol. I thought it was the ethanol blend that all cars can run and do just fine on, but for a more blend of more ethanol etc, you needs the flex shit. I mean how smart is it to change from methanol to ethanol and notr have any cars that can use it?
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