New Gen 3.5 in second Gen R/T? - DodgeIntrepid.Net Forums - Dodge Intrepid, Concorde, 300m and Eagle Vision chat
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-09-2005, 12:46 PM Thread Starter
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New Gen 3.5 in second Gen R/T?

Anyone here know if the new 3.5HO in the Chargers/Magnums/300's will fit in our cars? I asssume that there would be custom work involved, but will it fit otherwise? Sorry if this is already covered...and thanks in advance.
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 06:10 AM
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Why? It's the same engine. If you want some pep then look up a Kenne Belle Optimizer II A LOT cheaper than getting a new engine and will actually DO something. If your engine is toast then you could probably rebuild it cheaper than an LX engine. I believe YB said they are the same as far as bolt pattern goes but the plenum is different as i'm sure you've noticed. I am not sure if that plenum will bolt to our engine.
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 11:10 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks. I didn't know if they were any different or not. All I noticed was that the plenum was different. The Dodge site advertises in a way that makes it seem different. Guess you shouldn't believe everything you see on the net...LOL
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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 04:04 PM
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There may be subtle differences but the output is the same as the 300M 3.5 which only has a program change from your R/T the engine will produce the same 250 if you reflash. It will produce more with the Kenne Bell OPTII
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 01:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archael
There may be subtle differences but the output is the same as the 300M 3.5 which only has a program change from your R/T the engine will produce the same 250 if you reflash. It will produce more with the Kenne Bell OPTII
Actually, the later 300M's and the Special put out MORE than the "new" 3.5L's. But I'd still take the Kenne-Bell option if I could ...
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 06:15 AM
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hmm.. i thought i read somewhere they were at the 250 mark :P thanks for that D
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archael
hmm.. i thought i read somewhere they were at the 250 mark :P thanks for that D
The "new" 3.5L's are. But the 2002-04 300M (if I've got it right) are 255 while the Special is at 258. I'm pretty sure the SXT's are 250 for all years.

The TQ is all the same, thuogh, 250 ft.lb. across the board for all years of the HO - LH and LX ...

Last edited by D76G12; 11-11-2005 at 08:13 AM.
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 12:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D76G12
The "new" 3.5L's are. But the 2002-04 300M (if I've got it right) are 255 while the Special is at 258. I'm pretty sure the SXT's are 250 for all years.

The TQ is all the same, thuogh, 250 ft.lb. across the board for all years of the HO - LH and LX ...
thats not correct. the 99-01 300Ms were 253HP the 02-04 regular 300Ms were dropped to 250HP and all Specials from 02-04 are 255HP
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 02:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHAUN
thats not correct. the 99-01 300Ms were 253HP the 02-04 regular 300Ms were dropped to 250HP and all Specials from 02-04 are 255HP
I stand corrected - the 258 is ft.lb. for the Special. I suspect (though can't confirm right now) that the 255 is also ft.lb. for the standard 300M ...

Last edited by D76G12; 11-12-2005 at 02:40 AM.
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 12:29 PM Thread Starter
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Hmm, then besides an Optimizer, how does one reflash their PCM to get more HP (say 255 vs. my 244)?
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 01:00 PM
 
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Yea, Im currious about this 'reflashing' thing too. Is it something you could do by yourself? or is it a job for a Mopar Tech.?
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JVH1982
Hmm, then besides an Optimizer, how does one reflash their PCM to get more HP (say 255 vs. my 244)?
You've got an '00 R/T, right? If so, you have two choices (as far as I know). Get the Optimizer II or get a 2000-01 300M PCM from a junk yard and have it programmed to your car. If you opt for the junk yard route then be sure to match up the SKIS and/or factory alarm components. If your car doesn't have SKIS (Sentry Key - that's the thick gray key) then make sure the donor PCM doesn't have it. If you don't have the factory alarm I think (not sure on this one) you need a PCM w/out the alarm. Or you can install the needed components into your car from the donor. Once these functions are programmed into a PCM I don't think they can be removed. It takes a DRBIII unit to do the programming - that's an expensive ($3-4000) piece of equipment and usually means a dealer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 02R/T
Yea, Im currious about this 'reflashing' thing too. Is it something you could do by yourself? or is it a job for a Mopar Tech.?
If you have a 2002+ then you're pretty much stuck with Mopar. Your existing PCM can be flash upgraded but I don't think the main program can be changed. If you want that you'll need to buy a newer PCM that is programmed at the dealer and then talk the dealer Tech into using a 300M Special program instead of an R/T program. I'm not sure all 300M's have a high-speed PCM! In know the PHP (Performance Handling Package) cars and the Special do but I'm not sure about the "plain Jane" ones.


NOTE: There have been rumors that junk yard PCM's (or yours) can be erased and reused but I've seen no confirmation of that.
(TFC - have you learned anything new about that?)

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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 10:59 PM
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NOTE: There have been rumors that junk yard PCM's (or yours) can be erased and reused but I've seen no confirmation of that.
(TFC - have you learned anything new about that?)

Further reading about my upgrade can be seen here ...[/QUOTE]


No, I've not heard anything like the PCM being erased - something I'll have to ask my dealer. He is good with doing stuff like that when one is "nice" to him. A benefit of a small town dealer. I'll see what I can find.
I did find that the PCM can only be reprogrammed for the available stock tire sizes though. My Eagle F1s are not able to be put in. 225/55/17 is the only 17" size, and the 18" Specials, as well as 3 16" sizes.


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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-13-2005, 12:25 AM
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Someone on the 300M boards mentioned it so I thought I'd ask you about the PCM.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torontofirecaptain
I did find that the PCM can only be reprogrammed for the available stock tire sizes though. My Eagle F1s are not able to be put in. 225/55/17 is the only 17" size, and the 18" Specials, as well as 3 16" sizes.
On my PCM there was only one 16" size choice - 225/60/16. Maybe it depends on the program. No reason for the high-speed programs to know the other sizes ...
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 11-13-2005, 02:59 AM Thread Starter
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Spoke to my dealer and he pretty much confirmed what TFC and D are saying. Optimizer II and buying a different PCM is the only way. Dealerships can only reflash sensor settings, etc. They cannot alter the original programming (i.e. Fuel handling and timing.)
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