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post #1 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 05:03 PM Thread Starter
 
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Question Intrepid RWD Conversion Questions - Bolt Patterns

Hello to all - I've been lurking around regularly, but haven't posted in quite a while.

I'm seriously considering doing a RWD conversion on my 2001 Intrepid ES 3.2L, but before making a decision I want to gather some more information.

I know that this was discussed a few years back (in thread 41797), and I don't want to dredge up old posts, but the "answers" there were quite inconclusive (that, and the thread got sidetracked).
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I'm tentatively looking at using a 727 Torqueflite automatic transmission, or some version of it (i.e. A904/998/999, or perhaps even A500/A518 [for pickup truck], which have overdrive), although there are other possible options. I often deal with electronics and should have no problem with the electrical portions of doing this swap (what little there is with a tranny of this sort).

So everyone knows, I work at a Motorsports/Speed shop, so I know what I'm getting into here; I realize that this will be a sizeable job. I'm planning on removing the gas tank and going fuel cell, I'll need a custom driveshaft, etc.; I'm confident we can work out mounting the rear end and everything associated with that. It's the stuff "up front" that I'm concerned about.

Obviously, I'd be needing a custom flexplate. I'll need to make sure that the transmission will even FIT in the car (i.e. hit firewall). Also, I'm expecting to need a bolt plate as well, to convert from the bolt pattern of the 727 to that of the intrepid, but it's not impossible that one may already be out there. So, my question is:



What engines and/or transmissions share a bolt pattern with the Intrepid 3.2/3.5L engine?

Does it share a bolt pattern with ANY of the HEMIs, new or old [i.e. small/big block], or even some slightly older straight-6 engines (i.e. the 727 came on some I6s as recently as the mid-80s), etc.


I realize that no one is going to have a complete list, but knowing even one or two compatible bolt patterns would be extremely helpful and greatly appreciated!
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post #2 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 05:59 PM
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I'd check out the RWD powertrain used on the Prowler.

I forgot what tranny that was, I think it is a 42LE with a big shaft joining the two!
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post #3 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 06:05 PM
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what about the new charger? 3.5 rwd. That trans wouldnt be to cheap though
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post #4 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 08:15 PM
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Prowler trans would have to be mounted in the rear, to achieve RWD.
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post #5 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 08:34 PM
 
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One thing to consider up front when doing something like this is the wheel bearings. Once you no longer need half shafts in the front, what do you intend to use to support the wheel bearings? You're gonna need something in place of the outer cv shaft to support the bearing and hub assembly, otherwise the flange along with the wheel attached can slide out.
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post #6 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-08-2006, 08:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by froggy81500
One thing to consider up front when doing something like this is the wheel bearings. Once you no longer need half shafts in the front, what do you intend to use to support the wheel bearings? You're gonna need something in place of the outer cv shaft to support the bearing and hub assembly, otherwise the flange along with the wheel attached can slide out.
If you remove the half shafts there is nothing else to deal with in the front. There is no support from them.
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post #7 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 06:34 AM
 
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Yes there is. The splined end of the half shaft supports them. That's why when replacing either a cv or the bearings its important to properly tighten the nut on the shaft. Without it there, you're gonna end up with problems. Ask yor buddies int eh Motorsports shop and they'll tell you the same thing.
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post #8 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 09:43 AM
 
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I gotta look again. I thought the bearing was sandwiched between the outer flange and the the knuckel on the inside. I gotta find a blowup of it to see, I am bit too lazy to pop the corner apart! :circle:
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post #9 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 09:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by froggy81500
Yes there is. The splined end of the half shaft supports them. That's why when replacing either a cv or the bearings its important to properly tighten the nut on the shaft. Without it there, you're gonna end up with problems. Ask yor buddies int eh Motorsports shop and they'll tell you the same thing.
Basically correct, the shaft is the "fail-safe" so that the bearing cannot be forced out the rear.
Simple solution though, is to take the splined outer part of the shaft off and just insert it into the bearing and tighten it down. The shafts disassemble pretty easily.
Biggest issue I can see is the use of the older transmission in the equation, since it is all hydraulically operated, whereas the newer ones are predominately electronic, with the info it receives from the sensors being shared with the engine management system.. In which case, the newer engine controller would be "looking" for the non-existant transmission. You'd need to figure a way around that.


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post #10 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 09:59 AM
 
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They are but without the axleshaft in the center, you can pull the flange out. Just like the old style RWD cars had a spindle with a spindle nut on the end for the front bearings, so do these style bearings have an axle nut. I've got a worn set of FWD bearings from my wife's old Sebring in my cellar. I can pull the flange and hub out of them fairly easily. The rest of the assembly including the bearings inside do stay bolted to the steering knuckle.

One idea comes to mind though. Using just the splined end of the half shafts and remove the rest of the cv joint and axle shaft. I know the cv joints do come apart inside. I just don't know how you'd be able to torque them down without the remaining part of the axle attached to the tranny. And they need to be torqued a lot, like close to 200 ft.lbs.
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post #11 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 10:48 AM
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42LE (A606) - This is the only transmission that I know for a fact will bolt up to your 3.2L. Being its what you already have its not much help

A604 - Predecessor to the 606, came in a bunch of minivans and transverse engined cars. It had a 3.3L V6 attached to it at some point (which is the same pattern as the 3.5, 3.2, 2.7). It might not bolt up because it also had mitsubishi engines attached to it which I know are a different pattern. I'm pretty sure that trans had multiple bolt patterns throughout its existance.

42RLE - Used in magnums, chargers, and a jeep or two that I cant remember off the top of my head. It has all the same internal workings as a 42le except that its Rear wheel drive. If you can get one out of an LX car I'm 85% sure it will bolt up. The electronic controls are most likely the same, which could very likely result in a plug and play transmission. This is probably your best bet for as little pain and agony as possible.

Older V8 transmissions will not bolt up. I havnt looked at a new hemi yet, that might, but I doubt it

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post #12 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 10:53 AM
 
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I took some pics of the wheel bearings in my cellar. I have to run out to take the kids to a birthday party. When I get back later, I'll upload them and explain what I'm talking about.
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post #13 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 10:56 AM
 
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One other thing also comes to mind when trying to convert FWD to RWD. Clearance. While there is a hump down the middle of the car, unlike a real RWD car, the hump in a FWD is not as deep. You might not have enough clearance for the driveshaft. And even if you do, with suspension travel, you might end up with the driveshaft hitting th floorboards when you hit bumps.
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post #14 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 11:04 AM
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The rwd intrepid, the first gens anyways, were supposed to use a rigid mount differential, like the awd minivans. This allows the use of a torque tube drive shaft instead of the usual moving shaft. With a torque tube the shaft is fixed so they could use a much smaller hump. The existing hump is plenty big enough for the torque tube and the exhaust. However if you go to a solid axle rear and a moving drive shaft you will probably need to increase the hump's size.
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post #15 of 31 (permalink) Old 12-09-2006, 11:09 AM
 
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You guys realize that there has been a RWD LH built, right. There are some issues to work out, but it's obviosly possible. I just wonder why one would want to go through a project as big as this only to run a 3.2/3.5. I think the car is better the way it is. IMO, the only justifiable reason for going RWD is to put a V8 in.

I like thes kinds of projects anyway so I'd like to see how this goes. Good luck and I wish I could have had soem info on the trannies fot you.
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