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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I am posting this thread as a supplement to my "info for 2.7 owners" thread above, as this job is part of 2.7 ownership, guaranteed.

Now, here is what is involved and how to replace a water pump on a 2.7. This is not a job for the faint-of-heart, nor a job for those with no automotive knowledge.

The car is a 2003 Intrepid with 73K miles. It began overheating randomly, and upon inspection I found water leaking from the water pump weep hole, just below the thermostat housing. It would only leak at certain times. There are two weep holes on a 2.7, one is pictured, the other is below the lower intake manifold. If it leaks there, water will run out of the valley at the back of the engine and drip down around the transmission.

Here is the weep hole:


These also have the potential to leak into the oil, and cause the oil to assume a "milkshake" appearance. If this is the case with your engine, it is likely that you will need more than just a water pump/timing chain replacement. Your oil pan will need to be dropped, the engine flushed out, and the rod/main bearings inspected and or replaced, or replacement of the engine with a rebuilt unit.

Of course, check other places as well, including the water outlet, and the surge tank for cracks/leaks, and all the hoses. On this car, all that was good, and someone has recently replaced the water outlet:


These surge tanks will crack right near where the words "MIN" and "MAX" are embossed on the sides:



Here are the first steps of replacing the water pump. I will not outline everything word for word, so if you need steps on how to remove a specific component, it is all in the service manual, available here, or I can email you a copy if you shoot me a PM.

Remove the upper radiator support, and drain the coolant. Disconnect the battery, remove the air filter assembly, intake plenum, upper engine wiring harness, cooling fans, and upper radiator hose. Check and replace the lower radiator hose if needed. This is also a good time to inspect the trans cooler lines for leaks.

One....


Two....


Three....


Next, remove the valve covers and plenum....



Using the Chrysler Harmonic balancer puller (OTC 6284), remove the balancer.


Now, remove the alternator and a/c belt tensioner brackets, and the power steering pump.....this will allow you access to remove the front timing cover.


Remove the front cover, finally you can see the water pump:


This next step is critical. Using the procedure in the factory service manual, set up your timing chains and sprockets so that all timing marks are aligned. DO NOT rotate the engine after this point. You will use the gold plated links in the chain on re-assembly, they do not have to be lined up at this time. Marks on camshafts must be pointing as shown, and the arrow on the oil pump housing must be aligned with the slot in the crankshaft sprocket.

Remove the cam sensor and three cylinder head plugs on the front of the engine. Remove the primary timing chain tensioner cover, and tensioner. Starting with the left (passenger side) cam sprocket, remove the two bolts holding the sprocket to the camshaft. Remove the right cam sprocket. Remove all the chain guides. Remove the chain from the vehicle. Keep in mind, the cams will rotate about 20 degrees clockwise when the sprockets are removed, this is normal.

Be especially careful NOT to drop anything into the open oil pan below. It wont be fun getting a bolt out of there. The left guide has a spacer that likes to drop into the pan when you remove it also (ask me how I know).

I would suggest leaving the oil drain plug out, so any water or mess can flow out of the oil pan as you are working on the car.

Finally, remove the water pump. You can see the two weep hole passages (encircled by orange gasket) at the top and bottom of it.
 

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I hit **** with sticks!
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Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
Now onto the installation. First we take a quick look at the water pump. Purchase ONLY a Mopar water pump, from the Dodge Dealer. Do not use anything aftermarket from an auto parts store. The aftermarket ones I have seen are NOT the updated pumps; and will fail again.

Here are the visual differences between the original, and updated water pumps, and gaskets. Note the new water pump has a thicker body, which eliminates the need for the thick gasket on the old style pump. The old style gasket has embossed o-rings, which are prone to movement and leakage. The new gasket is a one piece plate coated with a polymer. The pulley is also heavier on the new style, as well as the internal bearings.





Next, clean all gasket surfaces thoroughly, and install the new water pump. Tighten the 6 water pump retaining bolts to 105 inch lbs. Now, it is time to install your inner (small) left and right timing chain guides. Tighten the bolts to 28 ft lbs. Take your drivers side camshaft sprocket and line up the arrow so that it falls in between the two gold plated links on the timing chain. Lower the sprocket and chain down thru the cylinder head hole. Set your sprocket on the front of the camshaft, and let it float for now, with no bolts in. Line up the single plated link on your timing chain with the slot cut into the crankshaft sprocket. Wrap the chain around the water pump, bring it up thru the head, and install your passenger side sprocket, lining the dot cut in the teeth to the last single plated link in the timing chain.

It should look like this at this point:


Your camshaft timing marks should look like this:


Crankshaft timing marks (hard to see with the radiator in the car, I use a mirror):


FSM Timing mark diagram:


Once you have your timing chain set up, next, install your left and right main timing chain guides. Double and triple check your timing marks while you are installing the chain and guides. The chain remains somewhat loose before the guides are installed and can easily jump a tooth.

Next, using a 3/8 breaker bar and extension in the end of the camshafts, rotate them slowly backwards (this will be opposite on each side) until the holes line up with the sprockets. Install your sprocket bolts and torque to 28 ft lbs. Next, install new cylinder head plugs, or replace the o-rings on the old ones.

Now it is time to set up the tensioner. Purchase a NEW tensioner from Mopar, it will be setup and ready to install. Make sure it has the Oring on it. Do not use a non-Mopar aftermarket tensioner from any auto parts store!

Install the new tensioner in the hole on the cylinder head. Make sure there is an o-ring on the tensioner, and the cover o-ring is replaced.

This step is critical, will cause serious engine damage if not performed. Once the tensioner is installed, you must activate it. Take a prybar and genly push down on the primary timing tensioner arm, towards the direction of the tensioner. You will feel the tensioner pawl release. Once this happens, release the pry-bar and the tensioner should extend.

Properly activated tensioner:


Next, dump some fresh engine oil on the chain and guides to lubricate them for initial startup. You will get some chain noise for 5-10 seconds after inital start up, this is completely normal. It will be whisper quiet after that.

Re-assemble the engine. Pay close attention to the condition of the PCV valve and hoses, replace as necessary.

This engine is one of the lucky ones, it has been well taken care of, (synthetic oil, frequent oil changes) and is nice and clean inside. The chain and guides all look good, so they can be re-used.

If you have an original style chain, and you want to replace it, you must update it to the newer style, along with the water pump, guides, and tensioner. The water pumps are still available for the old chain, but it will be the new design as pictured above (from Mopar). If you purchase the chain kit, it will use a different chain and sprocket tooth pattern (finer). I highly suggest you use this pump and not an aftermarket pump with the original gasket and body design.

Hope this helps with your water pump/timing chain swap job. If you have any questions feel free to ask me. Please keep your comments here related only to the water pump job. This thread will be heavily moderated.
 

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Ok... just when I thought I had all the info I needed... I get confused once again. :icon_rollSaulns said he used this water pump 4892425aa http://www.ebay.com/itm/1998-2010-CHRYSLER-DODGE-WATER-PUMP-2-7L-ENGINE-OEM-/270488367175?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3efa5cf047&vxp=mtr and that it's the newer style. Daytrepper, your water pump looks like 4892225aa. http://www.ebay.com/itm/270779417737?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649 I was told by a local Dodge dealer that I need 4892425aa and Steve White Motors in North Carolina said I need 4892225aa. It shouldn't be this confusing. :jeez: I need a definitive answer. pretty please..... I have a 2004 2.7 Intrepid. Will the old style timing chain work with a new style water pump?
 

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I hit **** with sticks!
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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
Ok... just when I thought I had all the info I needed... I get confused once again. :icon_rollSaulns said he used this water pump 4892425aa http://www.ebay.com/itm/1998-2010-CHRYSLER-DODGE-WATER-PUMP-2-7L-ENGINE-OEM-/270488367175?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3efa5cf047&vxp=mtr and that it's the newer style. Daytrepper, your water pump looks like 4892225aa. http://www.ebay.com/itm/270779417737?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649 I was told by a local Dodge dealer that I need 4892425aa and Steve White Motors in North Carolina said I need 4892225aa. It shouldn't be this confusing. :jeez: I need a definitive answer. pretty please..... I have a 2004 2.7 Intrepid. Will the old style timing chain work with a new style water pump?
Are you replacing your timing chain or re-using the original?

If you are replacing the chain, (and going with Mopar parts) you must use the updated pump and chain combination, which would be pump 4892425aa and the updated timing chain kit (68036787AA or 68036788AA). This pump and chain have the finer links and sprockets.

Use the 4892225aa if you are using the factory chain. That is the pump number I used in this job.
 

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Are you replacing your timing chain or re-using the original?

If you are replacing the chain, (and going with Mopar parts) you must use the updated pump and chain combination, which would be pump 4892425aa and the updated timing chain kit (68036788AA). This pump and chain have the finer links and sprockets.

Use the 4892225aa if you are using the factory chain. That is the pump number I used in this job.
I am trying to replace EVERYTHING possible with the new design (cam sprockets, pump, timing chain, etc). Saulns used 68036787ab not 68036788aa. That's this kit here. http://www.factorychryslerparts.com/showAssembly.aspx?ukey_assembly=568241&ukey_product=4492147 is this what I'm looking for?
 

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If I could butt in - yes you would use the same kit as Saulns - 68036787ab

68036788ab is the timing chain update kit for '98 thru '01.
68036787ab is the timing chain update kit for '02 and up - the difference is the tone wheel on the driver's side cam sprocket (tone wheel was changed when TCM was incorporated into the PCM in '02 MY).
 

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This picture is worth a thousand words, (To ME at least).

It shows how you can line-up the timing marks and not have to install the cam to sprocket bolts until later on. This is the exact way I do it and have found it's much easier than having to try and line-up 4 cams at one time. Well, actually 2 cams and a crank but, who's counting?

EDIT: I see you also have the original styled coolant crossover housing. While the engine was down this far, did you replace that with the updated one with the bleeder on the metal tube instead of the plastic housing?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
EDIT: I see you also have the original styled coolant crossover housing. While the engine was down this far, did you replace that with the updated one with the bleeder on the metal tube instead of the plastic housing?
The customer did not want to. They had paid a shop to replace it with an original style aftermarket outlet, about a week before they brought it to me....the shop never checked the water pump at that time.
 

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Excellent post!

As you can see a few threads down in the forum, I am having mine replaced due to it leaking exterior. But now seeing what my mechanic has to do I really don't feel bad paying the $600 for the job with the part included! And i'm glad I didn't try to take it on myself, i'm sure I coulda muscled through it, but glad I didn't and see this as money well spent since I figure i'll get another 100k from her after since she is a solid beast other than this problem.
 

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Daytrepper,

I have an 03 SE 2.7 with 130K miles on it. The water pump was replaced by a mechanic about 2 years ago now but I didn't know enough then to ask about what parts he used... oh well at this point.

Two questions:

- Is it possible to replace the primary tensioner without removing the timing cover? i.e. by just removing the passenger side valve cover? If so, can you provide a couple of steps... I am pretty green.

- Is it possible to determine which water pump was installed from the outside of the engine without any disassembly?

Thanks,
MD
 

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I just bought a 2004 Intrepid SE with the 2.7 in it. Does this year model have to worry about the water pump failure? I read on most sites including a few Chrysler sites that the problem mostly was from 1998 to 2002 and fixed between 2002 and 2004. my car has only 96800 miles and runs like a champ with very clean oil in it. Either it was garaged and meticulously cared for its whole life to date or this motor is a replacement already. Any way to tell if a motor has been replaced?? Do engine numbers match these days like in the 70s? This motor is super clean to a freaky point as not a single bit of surface rust on any of the parts normally expected to get it by now for its age. Dealer prep of a motor might make it shiny like new but that's as far as that goes, surface rust still shows when closely checked. Either way it is a great car and I hope to have it many years.
 

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I just bought a 2004 Intrepid SE with the 2.7 in it. Does this year model have to worry about the water pump failure? I read on most sites including a few Chrysler sites that the problem mostly was from 1998 to 2002 and fixed between 2002 and 2004. my car has only 96800 miles and runs like a champ with very clean oil in it. Either it was garaged and meticulously cared for its whole life to date or this motor is a replacement already. Any way to tell if a motor has been replaced?? Do engine numbers match these days like in the 70s? This motor is super clean to a freaky point as not a single bit of surface rust on any of the parts normally expected to get it by now for its age. Dealer prep of a motor might make it shiny like new but that's as far as that goes, surface rust still shows when closely checked. Either way it is a great car and I hope to have it many years.
My 04 SE made it to 88K before the WP started leaking. It also put oil into the water and vica versa... They (2.7) all have the issue.
 

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My 04 SE made it to 88K before the WP started leaking. It also put oil into the water and vica versa... They (2.7) all have the issue.
FWIW, my '99 2.7 ran on its original water pump and chain until I changed them at 207k miles - and that was pre-emptive - there was no indication of any problem - still running strong at 258k.

The more rugged 2.7 water pump design didn't occur until the new chain design *after* LH production stopped (was improved for the LX platform as the 2.7 was intended as the base engine for that platform and they wanted to remove that as a vulnerability). We get to benefit from that decision because it is backward compatible with our 2.7 engines.
 

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I followed you procedure and I am confused during installation.RH camshaft I need to turned CCW or
CW to match the holes on the camsprockt .And LH must be turned CCW or CW to match the hole
on The manual that I have does not specify.And Haynes manual tell me to tuned both RH &LH
shafts CW.With both camsprocket flooding I turned the RH shaft CCW tchto installed the screws and I
was not able to match one hole.Instead the main shaft moved about 6 leaks CCW and I had the chain
tensioner into reset position and by itself came in I activation position.A this point Iam lost and I need
your help very bad.
Thaks Giovanni Garofalo
 

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Check out the 2nd sketch from the FSM in my post no. 7 here: http://www.dodgeintrepid.net/showthread.php?p=1959018#post1959018

Notice every detail of all parts shown. By details, besides the positions of the gold links and sprocket marks, I mean, with the crankshaft mark lined up with the mark on the oil pump, an imaginary line thru the two bolts on each sprocket being in parallel with the top edge of each head, and the notches on the ends of the camshafts - passenger side notch pointing straight up (applies to *both* cam shafts on that side), driver side notch pointing about at 2 o'clock (again, applies to *both* cam shafts on that side). Also notice those same details in the 4th photo in Dan's post no. 2 above agree 100% with the details in that sketch.
 

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This picture is worth a thousand words, (To ME at least).

It shows how you can line-up the timing marks and not have to install the cam to sprocket bolts until later on. This is the exact way I do it and have found it's much easier than having to try and line-up 4 cams at one time. Well, actually 2 cams and a crank but, who's counting?

EDIT: I see you also have the original styled coolant crossover housing. While the engine was down this far, did you replace that with the updated one with the bleeder on the metal tube instead of the plastic housing?
Sorry I missed the #7 image.I see now what I did.Your #7 image shows RH shaft moved from 12oclock
to 11 oclock and the LH is at 3 oclock.Now mine they are at RH at 8 oclock and LH at LH at 10 oclock. I stop when turnig because I sow the cracksprocket moved CCW 6 leaks.Removed the chain.
Have any idea what I should do next?
Thaks for your help.
 

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This picture is worth a thousand words, (To ME at least).

It shows how you can line-up the timing marks and not have to install the cam to sprocket bolts until later on. This is the exact way I do it and have found it's much easier than having to try and line-up 4 cams at one time. Well, actually 2 cams and a crank but, who's counting?

EDIT: I see you also have the original styled coolant crossover housing. While the engine was down this far, did you replace that with the updated one with the bleeder on the metal tube instead of the plastic housing?
According to the #7 images the RH shaft when CCW when the cam was removed and the LH when
CW.I followed the manual tells me that both will turn CW.
Also I consult the Hayes manual and tells me the same thing.
Sorry for the screw up.
Thaks Giovanni
 

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I did not received any answer of the above message.Since that the crankshaft's cut is in line with oil pump and both camsproket are off in the ccw direction I decided to proceeding in remove both doncamevalve
assembly and retiming.I am thinking if I dont move the valve I can get all time in place.Please tell me if
my action will prevent any engine dammage.
Thanks Giovanni Garofalo
 

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I have nothing more to say other than this:
Check out the 2nd sketch from the FSM in my post no. 7 here: http://www.dodgeintrepid.net/showthread.php?p=1959018#post1959018

Notice every detail of all parts shown. By details, besides the positions of the gold links and sprocket marks, I mean, with the crankshaft mark lined up with the mark on the oil pump, an imaginary line thru the two bolts on each sprocket being in parallel with the top edge of each head, and the notches on the ends of the camshafts - passenger side notch pointing straight up (applies to *both* cam shafts on that side), driver side notch pointing about at 2 o'clock (again, applies to *both* cam shafts on that side). Also notice those same details in the 4th photo in Dan's post no. 2 above agree 100% with the details in that sketch.
Follow that, and you should be good to go - period.
 

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Before I removed the primary chain,RH and LH were looking at 12oclok and 2oclok.After I removed the
chain both cam shaft moved.RH moved CCW and LH moved CW.When I installed the chain all the time
marks were on the proper places.The camshaft sprockes floting on their shafts.The manual instructed atc
me to turn both shafts CCW to match the mounting holes of the sprockets, I used 3/8 break bar and starting with RH I was not able to see the mounting holes.Then I turn CCW the LH sproket and I hea
the pistons moving.Looking at the crankshaft mark and tuurned 3 to 4 leaks.I stop removed primary
chain completly.Without chain I moved back at the mark to meet the oil pump arrow.
 
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