[97purple_trep]

Ok, so heres the deal... I put a cone filter on w/ an intake pipe just like buschman's w/ the insulation, and 2 pipes. But I sense that the engine isn't reacting all that well.
It seems to have more power when its cold, and moreso late at night.

I think its getting to much warm air.

I don't have the off the line power that I used to either.

Im thinking about going back to home depot and finding some kind of aluminum or steel and blocking off the area around the cone from the rest of the engine...
I dont really like the idea of loosing my fog lights for ram air, and I dont really think its needed.

Any Ideas anyone? Is there something else?
I also know my engine isnt in tip top shape [Ive heard a tapping noise near the top [heads?] for a while, I dont think my valve timinig is perfect] Im wondering if more air could have amplified this to cause mushy performance.
The engine does have a lil more power, yes, but it is unresponsive, and slow. The biggest difference with the cone filter is the sound... The engine has sooooo much more bass, it sounds MEAN! from 3500 to 5500 rpm.

Any Input people?? Please??

 

[94IntrepidES]

As many of you know, no offense 97purple_trep, I am making a cold air kit for the 3.5L LH. I only have a filter under the hood cause I had to mount the MSD. I have no idea why anyone would do it on purpose to breath in all that hot air. Yes, breathing in all that hot air probably makes up for barely getting any cold air but whats the point? I moved my PCM and evap can with custom brackets. Now I can see the street with the hood open. I'm having a pipe bent to go down in front of the passenger wheel well. Then running an aluminum sheet under the car that will ram air to it and to the rest of the engine compartment.

 

[buschman]

That is a pretty slick idea. I was thinking something similar but was planning on doing it in a totally different fashion. 94 seems like a pretty slick guy so i'm sure he's familiar with aerodynamic principles. Air travels much faster, and with more pressure, over the car than it does under the car. My idea, which is along the same lines it to fashion an intake that pulls air from windshield wiper area. You know that black piece in between ytour windshield and hood where the wiper mechanism goes? Well that area stays very cool at all times and will receive a serious rush of air at speeds over 40 mph. I have been trying to design a way to pull air out of there and into the throttle bodies.

The problems I have encountered are these:

1)If I want to put the filter in the wiper compartment, it's a tight space and I'm having trouble finding a good K and N to fit in there.

2)If I put it in the wiper compartment I need a way to seperate rain and water from incoming air.

3)If I route incoming air to the engine compartment I need to find a way not to restrict airflow with a bunch of turns in the air intake pipe.

4)If the filter is in the engine compartment and I route air to it, I have to find a way NOT to make it look like ****. I think we all can tell asthetics are important to me

What do you gusy think? Any ideas or suggestions?

Buschman

 

[Mopar4U]

97 purple,

I posted a response last night but it doesn't look like it worked.

I have found the exact same results when I put my cone on! In the morning the car has a tremendous amount of pickup...until the motor reaches temp. If that is what ram air will feel like, look out! I didn't post anything about my cone results earlier because I thought I had a problem with my car. I think for now I am going to move my PCM and evap and try to move the cone towards the wheel well. But I do like the idea of the vents under the windshield. Hmmm... It is so hard to fabricate something without the proper tools. I wish I owned a machine shop

 

[Wutang15m]

Yeah you guys are right about one thing. when my car is cold and hasnt been warmed up its quicker and more responsive. but in the afternoon in the hot florida sun. after it has been warmed up for a while , it starts to loose performance.

 

[94IntrepidES]

Here is one idea I had. I was thinking take a inlet from a mid 80's turbo coupe and place it on the passenger side of the bulge in the hood. Then in the engine compartment build a box, panel K&N filter and have air drawn from the bottom of the box. Have a rubber gasket match up from the box to the hood when closed. I stopped this idea since I like the sleeper non modified look of the car. Yes buschman I know all that aero stuff I worked for NASA and got to work and see a lot of NASCAR teams test in the full scale tunnel. I like the idea I have cause you can't see it and will help push some cooler air into the engine compartment, but not so much your front end will take off over 100 mph, hehe. Hoping to get the pipe made this first week of fall semester at college. Hope to have some time, I just don't have a chance right now, but I might try tomorrow.

 

[Mopar4U]

94 ES,
1. What is the point of those vents under the windshield?

2. Are you talking about putting a box under those vents that will mate with the hood when closed? (WOW, 100% cool air with very little intake hose/pipe needed, SWEET)

3. Would our stock air box fit there if modified a little?

4. And are you also saying that you will get more air flow from those vents under the windshield rather than trying to get air from the wheel well hole under the PCM?

 

[buschman]

If V Tech were like 8 HOURS AWAY, I would say we should meet up and do some schemin. But 8 hours is a bit much.
I like your idea of moving the PCM only cause it doesn't require you to cut into the car.

Buschman

 

[97purple_trep]

Hey mopar, I posted a reply last night too, and read your original one then, now this morning i just came here and the 2 were gone.

Well anyway, 94intrepidES, can u explain the brackets to move the evap and pcm. Where did you go, did u have it done, did u fabricate these yourself, most importantly - How can I copy it!?? Unless its a secret that u dont wanna give away, but i hope not.

I like the idea with the vents under the window, but the dirt and rain I cant imagine how to get around, not to mention how difficult it would be to jam in there, and mount everything up... at least if we put it where the evap can and pcm are, theres bolts from the airbox mounts, and others, to work with.

 

[94IntrepidES]

Hehe, I'll try to explain everything I can. Ok, first the PCM I actually flipped it 180 so the wire harness is facing outward and not towards the engine. I did this so the brackets coming off the side of the PCM were over the frame rail. Then I got brackets from Home depot, like two L brackets and bolted them to together to form a C if you can imagine that. Each bracket is mounted to the frame rail with three sheet metal screws each. Then the PCM brackets are bolted to the top part of the C bracket with a bolt. To turn the PCM like this requires taking the wire harness running behind the front air dam to be pulled up so there is enough slack to turn the PCM and raise it higher like I did. The evap can is no longer against the wheel well but shoved all the way forward. I took some strapping and bent it, used some of the existing studs that hold the air box, PCM, and evap can metal plate and had the bracket attach there and do a 90 degree bend. The brackets has two holes to use two of the studs on the evap can, I did not worry about the third stud at all since this was strong enough. Now there is a pretty nice opening all the way down. I plan to run the intake pipe past the evap can and run a K&N Xtreme Filter I think it is with the pleated ends on the cone. Then take an aluminum sheet and mount it under the car and leave the front part downward somewhat to scoop in cold air and to not drag the ground hehe. I know some of this is hard to imagine put I will have pics of it all soon. I am currently trying to get an electrical breaker box small in size to house the two MSD tach adapters and all the wiring and have it over the PCM and evap can. That way they are out of sight and its clean. Then I'll take pics of the whole thing. I have no urge to hide any of this, though some have expressed interest in the pipe. I'll show everyone how I did the brackets so you can do what you like but if there is an interest I'll have a few more pipes made for you guys and I can send them out to you, not trying to start a business but I can't give them away free either hehe.

The hood scoop idea I'm going to try and photoshop so you can understand. If you have ever seen a T-bird turbo coupe they had hood inlets for the air inlet. Basically use one on the right side of the hood near the air box. I wouldn't use the stock air box. I make a box but move it over so that the scoop would fit right down to the box when the hood is closed. I just didn't pursue the idea cause of the work it involved and I don't like changing the outside of the car like that at all.

The vents under the windshield that I think you are referring to our for the climate control. The black oval vents take the air and all. You can see where the car breathes stock now. Look in that area with your hood open and go all the way to the passenger side. You'll see a squarish looking hole all the way against the base of the windshield and by the passenger door. That supplies the air to the fender well for the stock air box inlet. You could enlarge that hole if you want I guess and modify the air box to enlarge the fender hole and air box inlet. I'm sure that would help but I rather do the scoop I'm doing now to get cold air for the intake and under the hood cooling.

Sorry I don't post much I'm so busy, you can ask 93Intrepid, he knows my life story by now. I'll try to get some pics for you guys soon and help out. Sorry If I don't help enough I'll try better.

 

[97purple_trep]

Hey, Im just waiting for those pics doode! As for the pipe, what are your plans? I made one like buschmanns, for around $40
but now its gonna be too short.

Do you really think that scoop underneath is nesecary? I think it would be a much better idea to use the fog light holes. Yea I dont like the idea of loosing my fog lights, but you can get smaller ones to replace them that will fit next to your front license plate, inside the front fascia [bumper]. [mounting? well thats another issue]

Somebody brought this up before.
We need to make a master list of mods. Where the people who have already done them with positive results can post pictures and specifications and if they ended up developing something, sell their development [as in the case with the 2nd gens intake tube].... At the very least, create a pics section devodet to modification specifics.

Right now I'm trying to stick to things that don't cost alot, cause I wanna save up for rims and tires, then do a chip [I need to call those guys back... I randomly met some guys who do custom mod's to cars, including chips, and they said they can do a chip for me]

I'd like to say thanx to everyone for being so opean. This board is totally awesome, but can be better too!

 

[Wutang15m]

First of all you guys need to think about one little thing. if you get into a puddle youre engine is gone. My friend did the same thing as 94intrepidEs and, what happend was that he went over alittle puddle and the intake sucked it all inside. and bam there goes the engine so he advised me to keep the intake inside the engine compartament.

So you guys need to watch out with this, i dont think youre idea works 94intrepidEs.

Just like to tell you that

 

[94IntrepidES]

I know all about that. I don't just do Intrepids. The filter isn't going to be like that at all. The filter will be basically next to the evap can and wheel well. I'm letting the scoop put the air to the filter. Water will cover the bottom of the engine before it sucks in water, don't worry.

 

[jnutz]

I was reading an article in High Performance mopar of October 2001 called Chrysler PWG 300M^3. They put a Kenne-Bell designed ram air setup on a 300M. So I e-mailed Kenne-Bell for specs and such This was their reply.

"The ram air proved not to produce the HP results we'd like to see. The newer
the car, the more efficient they are - the factory engineers know due to
stricter mileage goals and emissions they have to design everything to get
the best results. The airbox nor the exhaust are restrictive, so there is not
much gain by changing either one of them. The computer on the other hand is
different. They (the factory) program the computers on all the Chrysler cars
(except the R/T, Stealth and Viper) to run on 87 octane fuel. This means
there's room for improvement if you use higher octane fuel (to prevent
knock). We can (and do) OPTIMIZE (improve) the spark and fuel calibrations so
the car will gain horsepower and torque. We also improve the shifting to give
much crisper, faster shifts to keep the car in the power band. Typical gains
are a minimum of 10HP and as much as 20-25HP! We don't do testing from 0-100
but we do test 0-60 and quarter mile times. 10HP is 1 mph faster and .10 in
the quarter mile, 20HP is 2 mph faster, .20 and 25HP is 2.5 mph faster and
.25 in the quarter. All our OPTIMIZER II performance upgrades are fully 100%
guaranteed for 30 days. If you don't feel like you received the gains we
promised, send the computer back and we reprogram it back to stock and give
you 100% refund. It's that simple (we know you will not send it back because
you'll LOVE the improvement!)...... "
I have not checked into this any further yet cause I am sicker than a dog, but can not bring myself to call into work. So I sleep and work.

 

[ATFCharger]

way to go jnutz! That was a nice reply they gave ya too. Well at least we have a little more information now about intakes/exhuasts; if only on the newer cars. Ours can't be too far off from that.

 

[jnutz]

Hey ATF, your sig is to big for my small crappy monitor, so now I have to scroll back and forth to read all the posts.

 

[MedicMan]

In reference to the cone filter idea, due to my limited resources, I had a friend make me a baffle out of aluminumn, with a hole in the centre or so , for the intake piping to go through. I had used white pcv piping bought at Home depot and followed the idea of another Intrepid owner on here. The white pipe goes from the large plastic oval tube ( where the restrictor cone was) and out to where the air box was. I then had the baffle made and fastened it to the front frame rail. With some rubber weatherstripping it keeps most of the hot air away and draws from under the computer. By the way, this is on the 3.3 Now it draws mostly cooler air. When I get a digital pic of it , I will post it.

 

[Dramradhel]

Somewhat off subject, But has anyone ever thought of redesigning the ductwork behind our TB's? I mean.. on the 3.5's, it's damn restrictive, especially on the driver's side!. I got a couple guys here and I are trying to redesign that part before we work on any cold air, hoping that freeing up a more natural path would be beneficial on top of adding said Cold air or Ram air later.. I dunno, just a thought

 

[buschman]

I was in the speed shop this weekend picking up a K & N for the Hawk, when the guy showed me this new reactive filter. Not sure if you guys have seen it but I ordered one for the Trep and it has given me all new ideas about how to run this setup.

Buschman

 

[MedicMan]

Hey Buschman....

I have the ractive airfilter..looks very similar to the K+N and it gets cleaned with the same kit. I do feel more power and as per my other post, I built a metal baffle to try keep the warm air away and draw cooler air from below.