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Discussion Starter #1
i was just curious with me having the engine out before the swap, do they have any bolt on performance parts i can install at this time.....

if they have any;
pulley kits
intake spacers

or anything that will dress up the engine bay....

thanks to all for the help, and i cant wait to get the swap done but i am going to take my time and make sure everything is in great condition i only like doing things once...
 

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If you got an extra lower intake Manifold, port it out. Changed the water pump, timing belt and EGR valve. I would clean the heck out of your throttle body and stand up the plenum to drain any oil. Not much bolt on items with this series, we try.

Late!
 
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You can get the crank shaft ASP Underdrive pulley (ASP.com i think..) , alternator Overdrive pulley (summit racing), intake spacer (PM KINGSPADE), find a bored out throttle body (maxbore.com), replace the engine ground straps with 4 gauge wire, put a new Thermostat in (160 degree available PM me if interested, keeps engine cooler)
Thermostat is a ridiculous pain with the engine in the car, and ASP Underdrive is a pain with the engine in the car. But before you put the ASP on, i agree on the timing belt, water pump, and timing belt tensioner.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Tons of good info, yes I am interEsted in the thermostat, I was going to have maxbore do my tb for my 2.7 b4 the rod knock. I will b checking on those pulleys n spacer tho sound good to me...I already have a great exhaust n the K&n intake alone with a 0 gauge upgraded ground to the chassis n a 4 gauge to the block as I will use them for the 3.5ho
You can get the crank shaft ASP Underdrive pulley (ASP.com i think..) , alternator Overdrive pulley (summit racing), intake spacer (PM KINGSPADE), find a bored out throttle body (maxbore.com), replace the engine ground straps with 4 gauge wire, put a new Thermostat in (160 degree available PM me if interested, keeps engine cooler)
Thermostat is a ridiculous pain with the engine in the car, and ASP Underdrive is a pain with the engine in the car. But before you put the ASP on, i agree on the timing belt, water pump, and timing belt tensioner.
 

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heres a good thought on the thermostat.. If you cant change what temperature the fans turn on at what good does the thermost do opening at 160. Just a thought from someone who has done over 20 lower temp thermostats....
 

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Discussion Starter #6
How can I change what temp the fan turns on at?
heres a good thought on the thermostat.. If you cant change what temperature the fans turn on at what good does the thermost do opening at 160. Just a thought from someone who has done over 20 lower temp thermostats....
 

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well, as someone who had one of these in these cars it does literally drop the temperature on the gauge a half tick below normal during normal driving at all times. It makes the biggest difference if you race and are starting from cold. The engine would stay cool longer during the high RPM run.
 

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well, as someone who had one of these in these cars it does literally drop the temperature on the gauge a half tick below normal during normal driving at all times. It makes the biggest difference if you race and are starting from cold. The engine would stay cool longer during the high RPM run.
Difference when starting out cold and a high RPM run? Then why don't we just let our cars sit so the coolant temp is under 100° and fire them up, run them at 6500 rpm down the track and wonder why our rings and valve springs are shot.

This engine is not your 1970 small block chevy with a flex fan where everything functions better cooler. Has anyone every tried actually collecting data on this lower temp thermostat in this particular engine? Temperature not only plays a role in air fuel mixture but timing.

If your coolant is not allowed to stay in the radiator long enough for the fan to cool it down and is continuously circulating the engine will run warmer with the lower temp stat than it would with a OE temp stat unless your fan is programmed to work in conjunction with the stat setting.

Botom line if you are not changing your fan settings you are not changing much.
 

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How can I change what temp the fan turns on at?
You will have to see if anyone in the aftermarket offers a lower temp fan switch or have your PCM reprogrammed (which is ridiculously expensive for Chrysler and I am aware of 2 companys that are able to do them. If this is the only mod done it is not worth $350 to have your fans reprogamed.)
 

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do a search for shadowvox6 as the poster and the thred of 'proof a 160 tstat works'
 

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You may want a catch can. I don't know that there are any specifically for our car, but there are lots of generic ones that would work.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
You can get the crank shaft ASP Underdrive pulley (ASP.com i think..) , alternator Overdrive pulley (summit racing), intake spacer (PM KINGSPADE), find a bored out throttle body (maxbore.com), replace the engine ground straps with 4 gauge wire, put a new Thermostat in (160 degree available PM me if interested, keeps engine cooler)
Thermostat is a ridiculous pain with the engine in the car, and ASP Underdrive is a pain with the engine in the car. But before you put the ASP on, i agree on the timing belt, water pump, and timing belt tensioner.
i cant seem to find the pulley for the alternator overdrive pulley, i just got my asp pulley in the mail today it looks sweet..
 

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Nitrous oxide is a relatively simple bolt on that will boost your performance like nothing else. The offset is transmission life and the possibility of melting pistons or an unscheduled disassembly of the rods or crank.
 

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...If your coolant is not allowed to stay in the radiator long enough for the fan to cool it down and is continuously circulating the engine will run warmer...
I have read that stated by people several times before. As an engineer, that has never made any sense to me. Is it possible that that is a myth and people are just repeating the myth that they've heard? I can give physical laws that explain why that should not be so.

As far as the lower temp t-stat not accomplishing anything without also changing the fan turn-on temp., that would depend on if the t-stat more or less suddenly goes from fully closed to fully open at some point during warmup, or if (except under extremely hot conditions) the t-stat doesn't go to full open and stay there but instead modulates to help actually continuously regulate engine temperature. I've heard differeing opinions on whether it goes to full open and stays there or if it is an active part of closing the engine temperature control loop. ALSO - if it does in fact modulate to control the temperature, having a lower temp. t-stat would require the fans to run less, extending their life. Don Scruggs (Red Baron) claimed that he saw lower fan duty cycle and longer fan life after putting in the 160º t-stat.

...and the possibility of melting pistons or an unscheduled disassembly of the rods or crank.
Now that there is funny I don't care who yare!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Nitrous oxide is a relatively simple bolt on that will boost your performance like nothing else. The offset is transmission life and the possibility of melting pistons or an unscheduled disassembly of the rods or crank.
seeing how im replacing a motor that has a bad rod knock, i dont think so....

but funny tho
 

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I have read that stated by people several times before. As an engineer, that has never made any sense to me. Is it possible that that is a myth and people are just repeating the myth that they've heard? I can give physical laws that explain why that should not be so.

As far as the lower temp t-stat not accomplishing anything without also changing the fan turn-on temp., that would depend on if the t-stat more or less suddenly goes from fully closed to fully open at some point during warmup, or if (except under extremely hot conditions) the t-stat doesn't go to full open and stay there but instead modulates to help actually continuously regulate engine temperature. I've heard differeing opinions on whether it goes to full open and stays there or if it is an active part of closing the engine temperature control loop. ALSO - if it does in fact modulate to control the temperature, having a lower temp. t-stat would require the fans to run less, extending their life. Don Scruggs (Red Baron) claimed that he saw lower fan duty cycle and longer fan life after putting in the 160º t-stat.

Now that there is funny I don't care who yare!
As a fellow engineer remember this is a pressurized system. Coolant consistantly cycling not being held will only increase in temp, how fast will depend on the water to coolant ratio and type of cooalnt utilzied IE Ethylene Glycol, Propylene Glycol or OAT (Dex-Cool)
 

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...Coolant consistantly cycling not being held will only increase in temp,...
Again, I'm just saying that that does not make sense from a heat transfer standpoint. The higher the temperature gradient (coolant to ambient air), the greater the loss of heat (to the air) - that is the key to answering the question. Thermal properties, though time dependent, have no inertia (delay in starting the transfer of heat energy). The heat flow doesn't know (is not directly affected by) how fast the coolant is flowing, nor is there a delay in starting the transfer of the heat - it only knows the temperature difference, and the higher that is, the greater the rate of heat transfer. It isn't one of those things that is easy to think through and come up with the right answer because it is a limits (Calculus) kind of process.

If you think about it in terms of the temp. decrease of a given volume of fluid each time it comes around - yes - if it is flowing faster, it will not see as much decrease in temperature on a given trip thru the radiator. But if you factor time in, it is making that round trip much more often, and though it doesn't loose as much heat on a single trip, the fact that it is making the trip more often results in a net gain in heat loss (due to the heat loss being more rapid due to higher temperature gradient). That's the "limits" aspect that I was talking about.
 

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You have to assume that the radiator/fan system, if working properly, is more effective at removing heat then the engine is at putting heat in, otherwise a car would always eventually overheat.

But yes, the $64,000 question is will the tstat modulate throughout a drive once it's already opened.
 

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You have to assume that the radiator/fan system, if working properly, is more effective at removing heat then the engine is at putting heat in, otherwise a car would always eventually overheat...
True. With everything working properly as you say, the system has more than enough capacity to remove the heat the engine is putting out under all conditions. If that weren't the case, the fans would be operating at 100% duty cycle. If the two (heat from engine, heat from radiator to air) were exactly the same, temp. gage would read normal, but fans would be on all the time. If the balance shifted beyond that (i.e., rad. couldn't keep up), then fans continue running 100% and temp. gage starts rising. The greater the deficit, the higher the gage goes. I think we're saying the same thing.
 
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