[RMasters]

Hello all,

We came here because of an issue with our Intrepid, looking for help. Always great to see other people with the same "toys" and helping each other out.

Our 2001 Intrepid SE serves us well. Well, we don't mess around with it. We have a little over 220,000 miles on it, guess we got lucky with our engine. We change the oil every 3,000 miles, we have been asked before if we had an oil change done recently because it looked fairly clean. Oh well, we mostly drive on E85, that certainly helps.

We have (from what we heard) some common issues, like the temperature selector know can not be turned completely to cold, it will blow warm. But turning it 1 notch up makes it work. Power door lock on passenger rear side does not work. Actually, that is it.

So, we hope to get many more miles out of her. She is getting some rust spots which would have to be addressed at some time, but right now getting her back running is job no. 1.

Ciao all!

 

[cdmccul]

You run on e85???

Your car is not happy about that I'm sure...even if you don't think it is, running on e85 will come up to get you.

Welcome to the forum though! Psst pics when you can.

Which engine do you have? Guessing 2.7 based on being an SE car.

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[beeblebrox82]

welcome!!

 

[RMasters]

Thank you for the welcome.

Yes, it is a 2.7 liter. And no, E85 will not come back to you. I know, for you guys here it is late, I was running E85 in the 80's already, eventually you will catch up on things.

I can put some pictures up, but ours is stock. Silver with black interior and floor shift, steel wheels with original covers. Only updates were a new front bumper now with fog lights (not hooked up yet, am not that good with that) and the Ethanol computer. Thus this now encourages me to wash/wax her and do so. Give me till this weekend.

Looks like we are having a break on our fuse issue, thanks to the input from member PEVA we have some leads in case the issue arises again.

I can not give any input on the Intrepid as it never caused any issues to us, and I am not looking forward to it. LOL Ford would be a different stories. Wait, we had the shifter cable replaced a month ago! Yeah, common issue I red.

Keep them running, you can't buy such a great looking car (timeless design IMO) today. And with 29 mpg on the highway, I laugh about a modern car which get's 35 mpg. Cause we have space, comfort, a solid ride and a trunk which is HUGE (thus I wish I would have the rear fold down seats sometimes).

 

[cdmccul]

e85 in the 80's? You sure you're not running e10, the standard 10% ethanol mix in that is at 99.9% of the gas pumps across the US (and has been since the 80s)? I agree that e10 is fine to run.

 

[Ronbo]

Sounds like a car imported from another country?

 

[cdmccul]

That too...

 

[bh1992]

and I'd have to think that getting 29mpg would be one heck of a stretch for E85. might get 29mpg with E10 if you are real easy on the gas pedal. but you have to burn about 40% more fuel when burning straight ethanol rather than E10. with E85 I'd imagine that you would burn at least 30% more fuel than you would with regular gasoline

 

[RMasters]

Oh boy, you guys have a lot to learn. It's out there, you can check for yourself, but use some reliable sources, like an encyclopedia or similar. Then you don't have to "assume" or "imagine".

The US law that all vehicles must be able to cope with Ethanol and run on at least E10 (10% Ethanol and 90% gasoline) was passed in the 80's, and in effect 1/1/90. So all cars were already capable copying with Ethanol (different parts like rubber lines etc. etc. were replaced). E85 is just a higher concentration, and the only limitation is the computer in the car (as the injectors have to open more to compensate for the larger amount of Ethanol needed vs. gasoline).

E85 has been out there for a long time, just because you don't know about it does not make it non-existent. Heck, if I can sell you expensive items and you pay for it, I go for it! You know that the read deals are in the bottom shelf, it is just so more convenient for some not to go down on their knees and look.

And regarding gas mileage, there have been enough tests that showed that the worse fuel to use is straight gasoline. Using E10 up to E30 in most tested vehicles turned out to give you either the same gas mileage as with regular gasoline, or sometimes more.

And of course it depends on the vehicle. Our van (which runs "under load" most of the times) looses more than the Intrepid. With the Intrepid, we loose maybe 1 mpg in city traffic, in the winter time less. This is with E85!

Naturally it all depends on how you drive, that is where mpg's come from. And if you call someone slow just because they don't do stupid accelerations only to have to hit the brakes on the next traffic light again, well, then here is your sign.

This is worth it's own post and discussion, but very often people like to live in their imagination and don't want to invest time and effort in learning new things. I'm open to chat about that. And with me are tons of other people who do what I do, for decades, how is that for that it exists and works just fine?

 

[Duds]

E85 contains 75,670 British thermal units of energy per gallon instead of 115,400 for regular unleaded gasoline.
Since there is no energy gain in the use of E85 I will not entertain that E85 can possibly equal the same MPG per dollar spent as regular gas. Let alone surpass it. Laws of nature.
Unless you are running one of those electric superchargers, coupled to a flux capacitor.

 

[GTXKen]

In every study I have read E85 at the current price is not an economical alternative. A vehicle on E85 burns more fuel than it does on E10, that's a FACT. Alternatively E85 has a higher octane rating so it is an economical alternative to methanol facing fuels.

 

[Vilgent]

This is worth it's own post and discussion, but very often people like to live in their imagination and don't want to invest time and effort in learning new things. I'm open to chat about that. And with me are tons of other people who do what I do, for decades, how is that for that it exists and works just fine?

Sounds real 'open' to me

 

[peva]

...The US law that all vehicles must be able to cope with Ethanol and run on at least E10 (10% Ethanol and 90% gasoline) was passed in the 80's, and in effect 1/1/90. So all cars were already capable copying with Ethanol (different parts like rubber lines etc. etc. were replaced). E85 is just a higher concentration, and the only limitation is the computer in the car (as the injectors have to open more to compensate for the larger amount of Ethanol needed vs. gasoline)...

I have to disagree with you on that. FWIW, I was the design lead engineer for fuel pump parts that my employer at the time supplied to Delphi (is to GM what Visteon is to Ford) from '92 thru '00. I sat in fuel pump design meetings with the GM fuel sysems engineers, and I can tell you that GM's fuel systems engineers knew that parts and materials adequate for E10 were not adequate for E20, E30, or higher. Incrementally increased concentrations of ethanol required drastically different materials.

It was obvious to me from those meetings that it was clear to those in the industry that the increases in ethanol content *had* to be incremental over long periods of time as the manufacturers learned to cope with unique problems of higher and higher ethanol content that only field experience (consumers-as-guinea pigs) could reveal.

Ask me about ethanol molecules being so small that they would permeate sealed plastic-film capacitors used for EMI/RFI suppression in fuel pumps and etch away the vapor-deposited metal plates of the capacitor (no metal => no more capacitance = no more EMI/RFI suppression).

 

[cdmccul]

So, Bill, tell me about the effect of ethanol molecule size and the relation to passing through what was once thought sealed? Why would you have the authority to speak to such things?

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[cdmccul]

So, Bill, tell me about the effect of ethanol molecule size and the relation to passing through what was once thought sealed? Why would you have any authority to speak to such things?

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What? He said to!


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[DrDodge]

Page 164 of the owners manual for the special,, says , some fuel suppliers blend unleaded gas with materials called oxygenates such as 10% ethanol, MTBE and ETBE, oxygenates are required in some areas of the country durning winter months to reduce carbon monoxide emissions, nowhere does it say you may use 100% corn, (ehanol), just a opnion,, but corn is made to eat,, not burn,, well corn mash makes some mighty fine booze.but being the btu of it is lower, im surpized that the car dont ping its self to death and rubber parts arent rotting off, heck,, my old 2000 trep 2.7 would give 33 on the highway,, on pump fuel

 

[RMasters]

I have to disagree with you on that.

Again, do some reading, the facts are there, it is a federal law/regulation/requirement.

A hint: See the Clean Air Act, section CAA § 201-219; USC § 7521-7554. There you have all the details, dates etc. etc. etc., even some technical information.

This counts. Cars are not build by someone who is something at some place. Cars are build to comply with federal requirements.

 

[bh1992]

Please be more specific. I only took a quick look, but I did not see anything that pertained to ethanol content of fuel or the requirement of vehicle parts to handle any certain quantity of ethanol.

 

[Duds]

Still looking for this study...................


Permeation effects study
(A) In general
Not later than 1 year after August 8, 2005,
the Administrator shall conduct a study,
and report to Congress the results of the
study, on the effects of ethanol content in
gasoline on permeation, the process by
which fuel molecules migrate through the
elastomeric materials (rubber and plastic
parts) that make up the fuel and fuel vapor
systems of a motor vehicle.
(B) Evaporative emissions
The study shall include estimates of the
increase in total evaporative emissions likely
to result from the use of gasoline with
ethanol content in a motor vehicle, and the
fleet of motor vehicles, due to permeation.

Unless this is it, but the law says the Administration shall conduct a study.

http://www.airimprovement.com/reports/api_permeation_report_1.pdf

 

[Duds]

Sorry, you made a claim now please give detailed reference to substantiate your claim. I went and read your material, (very lengthy) and maybe I missed it but.....