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Discussion Starter #1
Ok, here's the deal.

2000 Dodge Intrepid ES, 282,000+ on the clock, strictly maintained, original motor and trans. After finally getting tired of warping rotors, I bought a set of iRotors cross drilled rotors (all four) and Hawk HP+ pads.

After a short break in period, I noticed a squealing from the front right wheel upon hard braking. This only occurred when almost at the end of a complete stop, and only after about a half hour of driving. The squeal was DEAFENING, I knew something had to be wrong.

I'm a Ford Tech, so it's not like I could have installed the brakes wrong, but regardless, I made it happen one day after work, then quickly put the car up on the lift and took all four wheels off. I had a co-worker drive it up to 50mph on the lift and make some stops, the noise was still happening and yet visually everything was perfect. This co-worker confirmed there is nothing wrong visually with anything (he was formerly a 22 year Chrysler Master Tech, so there rules out any Dodge/Ford differences I could have overlooked). I re-greased the caliper bolts and applied anti-squeal to the pads, and drove it again. Same noise.

A week later it's still happening (about 2500 miles now), so I switched the front pads left to right. Keep in mind there are no rear problems whatsoever. While switching pads, I notice that the inside of the rotor of the side the noise is coming from (passenger side) has a groove in it. about .010" wide and .001" deep. interesting, the problem is obviously on the inside of the passenger side.

well, after switching pads, the noise is now coming from the driver side. about 500 miles and the inside of the driver side rotor is showing marks in the same place that the passenger side was.

to rule out any variables, I went to autozone and picked up el cheapo rotors and pads for the front.

autozone pads + autozone rotors = no noise
Autozone pads + iRotors = no noise
Hawk pads + iRotors = noise, still only that one side.

So I took a digital recording of the noise and pictures of the damage to the rotors, etc. I call up Hawk and give them all above information. It is my belief that the one inside pad has something wrong with it...a rare hardspot or hotspot. Although there is nothing that can be seen with the naked eye wrong with it.

I'm expecting to get bullshitted and be up the crick without a paddle because of the fact that these are aftermarket products, but I get a pleasant surprise. After going through all the information, the tech on the phone sees my thorough diagnosis and tells me...

"Although we normally would never do this, it seems like you took every possible measure and have done a thorough investigating job, so we're going to send you out another set of replacement front pads."

He takes my full name, phone number, and address, didn't even confirm that I actually bought a set to begin with. Wow, what trusting guys. I bought it through tirerack and the guy on the phone before him said I would have to go through them. I asked if they wanted the affected pads back to see what was wrong with them and help them prevent problems in the future, said I could keep them.

HAWK! YOU ARE THE ****ING MEN! Now THAT is customer service, I expected to get dicked around ten ways to Sunday. Seriously, this is why I patronize some companies. I will never buy a set of non-Hawk pads again! I think this came to a just and honest conclusion, and what they did is right, but as we all know 99% of the time with aftermarket stuff you get screwed. They went above and beyond what they had to do to do what they thought was right. HAWK ****ING OWNS!

:blunt:

victory dance = :elefant:
 

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Sound a lot like what Bendix customer service is like. :)

Although I ask for the pads back so I can review them.

Come on..I had to put that in there. :)

But I can't speak for Advance Auto. Some of the customer service stories I heard from them back me cringe. But it's not all of them.

btw....I've been using Hawk HPS pads for about a week now and so far I am loving them.
 

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I'll just stick to my Wagner Thermoquiet pads and not have any noise issues ;)
 

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I also just put the Hawk HPS's all around on my car, along with new front rotors. Brake feel has improved 10 fold.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
ltrain01rt said:
I also just put the Hawk HPS's all around on my car, along with new front rotors. Brake feel has improved 10 fold.
yeah I had HPS's before I went to the HP+'s, you think your braking is good now...

first time my brother pounded on them said he hurt his chest on the seatbelt :D still performs even with the noise

rivals my Probe (when stock) braking, a much lighter and more nimble car. good balance front and rear, little or no fade. [now the probe has 14" fronts with 8 pistons and 12" rears with 2 pistons...it stops decently :D]
 

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hmm.. sounds like when I go to do my brakes soon, I'll be lookin for a set of these pads for my 1g..
 

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Avenger said:
I'll just stick to my Wagner Thermoquiet pads and not have any noise issues ;)
That is the same pads we use at work and they do work great.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I wouldn't exactly call it a "noise issue." It's a metal on metal sound, and something is putting a groove in my rotor.

As far as how noisy they are, when you really get on em, you can hear them bite from inside the cabin; for a racer like me, this is a good thing, not a bad thing :)
 

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Word of advice...when you slam on the brakes to see how good the pads stop you, make sure you have nothing laying on your seats. :)

I had to let off the brake to prevent the other half of my stuff from ending up on the floor. :)

Love these tires too. Damn. Stoped almost on a dime with a very slight squawk from the tires and no ABS activation. Gotta love that.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
actually, lots of ABS pulsation would indicate that the pads and rotors are stopping the car so hard that ABS is required to keep the tires from straight-out locking up and sliding ;)

but yeah, I know what you mean with leather seats
 

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I need to replace my brakes soon.. I wish I knew enough about cars to replace them myself... but that's just not the case :/.

Right now my car is in a world of hurt for a lot of reasons tho.. so I have to get the bigger problems fixed first hehe
 

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95PGTTech said:
actually, lots of ABS pulsation would indicate that the pads and rotors are stopping the car so hard that ABS is required to keep the tires from straight-out locking up and sliding ;)

but yeah, I know what you mean with leather seats

Exactly. Since the ABS never kicked in, that is an indication of damn good tires. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Warlord187 said:
Exactly. Since the ABS never kicked in, that is an indication of damn good tires. :)
interesting way of looking at it :)
 

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95PGTTech said:
interesting way of looking at it :)
Well, in reality, brakes slow your car down, while the tires is what stops you. So if you slow down quicker than your tires can handle, than you start to skid. I can tell a huge difference in stopping distance between my summer tires and my winter tires (using the same pads/rotors).
 

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so are the APS pads better than the performance ceramics? What is top notch? I'd like to mimic your brake setup Warlord as you are the resident brake addict...let me know some parts numbers if you would...i've been sending you PM's but you don't respond...what did i do??
 

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Sorry. I really haven't been on the board much lately. I'm liking my current setup. Stops the car very well and very little dust. I'm sure I will try something completely different this spring. Well, at least in the front. I like to change the pads/rotors in the spring regardless if they need to be changed or not because I want to try new things. My current setup is as follows...

Front Pads --> Bendix CT-3 {D730CT}
Front Rotors --> Bendix Street HP {145263FML, 145263FMR}
Rear Pads --> Bendix CT-3 {D658CT}
Rear Rotors --> iRotors x-drilled/slotted (for some reason we don't have the Street HP rotors for the rear :( )

The D658CT pads actually have a higher coefficient of friction (GG), also known as mu, than the D730CT pads (FF). The theory is that with a higher mu on the rear it will shift some of the braking to the rear pads. I really haven't felt like doing the math on this one. :) But that isn't the only reason I went with these.
 

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Just in reply to the original title of this threrad. HAWK ****ING SUCKS! I will be putting pretty much the exact same setup as warlord in the spring. I'm tired of the shitty hawk pads squealing and making more brake dust than I've ever seen.
 

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00r/t.mopar.muscle said:
I'm tired of the shitty hawk pads squealing and making more brake dust than I've ever seen.
You forgot to add "without the added performance." :)

I had the same experience. The HPS pads were noisey and dusty. They did stop the car and I certainly didn't feel "unsafe", but I expected a big improvement in stopping performance. I didn't see that improvement. There are just other pads out there that can offer the same or better performance without all the dust or noise.
 
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