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Discussion Starter #1
anybody ever try any of these high mileage motor oils? Been thinking about switching to one for the hell of it and looking for any input. Been using Havoline regular dino oil for the past several oil changes and would like to stay with the havoline but nobody around here stocks the high mileage version. After looking at spec sheets on some, Valvoline Max Life is probably the one I'd pick. Sticking with 5W-30 dino BTW. A few reasons why I've been thinking about trying an HM oil to see if there's any change in oil consumption as well as see if it helps with the slight seepage at the back of my pan.

any comments appreciated, whether it be your opinions on HM oils, personal experiences or those of friends/family with HM oils, etc...

Yes I did try the search first before starting a new thread, but words like "oil' and "mileage" yield hundreds of threads.
 

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I am a sucker for advertising and I use it in 1 of our cars.
It's a 1965 Plymouth Belvedere with a 225 cu in. 6 cyl.

The engine has never been out of the car or serviced internally. I figure it deserves "high mileage" oil.
 

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I use Kendal hi mileage oil in the Dakota, 3.9 auto,,, blah blah,, anyway im very happy with it,, it dont use a drop between changes anymore to where it use to use 1/2 a quart every 3k
I did try it in the trep ONCE NEVER AGAIN!!,, it sucked it up like i drink water,, wernt back to synthitic blend 10w-30 and its fine again,,, go figure
 

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I used to use Mobil 1 High Mileage in my wifes Neon. She had some small leaks on some seals around the engine. The oil didn't do a thing, so I just spent some money are replace the seals that were leaking. Now I just run reg. dino oil in her. and no more leaks.
 

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Engines with more miles on them sometime need a little extra care. That’s why there’s Mobil Clean High Mileage. Designed for vehicles with more than 75,000 miles, this advanced formulation helps protect seals and prolong engine life. With 16 percent more cleaning additive than our conventional oil*, Mobil Clean High Mileage helps control the formation of sludge and harmful deposits to keep engines running cleaner longer.
I did put Mobil 1 High Mileage last time, it only has more cleaning agents and thay said it has an additive to protect the seals, it won't help but it won't hurt either.
 

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First, the Havoline dino you're using is absolutely one of the best - if not THE best - dino oils that you could use. On BobIsTheOilGuy.com, there is a pile of Used Oil Analysis from all sort of engines using Havoline and the results are consistently outstanding. Havoline seems to use some unique combination of base stocks and additives that produce these results. If you changed nothing and stayed with regular Havoline, you wouldn't be doing a bad thing.

As for the HM oils, I've used Valvoline Maxlife HM (dino) in my 2.7 for a long time. Maxlife actually contains around 20% PAO (synthetic - like M1) along with higher than normal levels of detergents and seal conditioners. I've probably got 75,000 miles (or more) of running time with Maxlife. I couldn't prove that Maxlife has done anything that a less expensive oil would have done. But I'm approaching 163K miles on my 2.7 with no big maintenance items and it still runs like new, if that indicates anything.

The viscosity of Maxlife 5W-30 is quite similar to a regular 5W-30. However many High Mileage oils are considerably thicker (more viscous) than their non-HM counterparts. Castrol GTX HM is a good example of this. GTX HM also contains higher levels of additives than regular GTX. On BITOG, the general consensus is that Castrol GTX HM dino is probably the best HM dino there is, and that is based on used oil analysis and anecdotal evidence by many users. Maxlife is viewed to be more marketing than a real improvement in oil chemistry, but Maxlife is certainly a far more robust oil than regular Valvoline All Climate. Still, there are a lot of Maxlife users on BITOG and many report smoother, quieter running engines with it.

Some people start using HM oils and report seal leaks that stop within a few hundred miles or perhaps within a couple of oil changes. Other users report no change at all. Seal conditioners can only do so much; they can not repair a badly worn or torn seal.

I've never had an oil analysis done on Maxlife from my 2.7 so I can't offer any more real info. I've also done several runs of Castrol GTX HM 10W-30, which is fairly thick stuff and I use it during the summer because of it's higher viscosity.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Well, as far as I've read and can remember, the Valvoline Maxlife was the first HM oil to come out. And I've read exactly what you're saying that they are thicker. From what I've been reading, they formulate (not sure if that's the right word) HM oils more toward the upper end of the viscocity range. So my thinking would be that regular dino 5W-30 is more down toward the 5 weight where a 5W-30 HM is more toward the 30 weight.

I've been on BITOG a little bit here and there and I'll have to look some more for more UOA's using havoline. There was another site themotoroilsite.com I think was the address, and they have comparison tables in pdf and excel formats comparing the specs of different oils broken down by weights. They also ranked them using a formula and the havoline ranked up there along with some synthetics and blends near the top. Some specs (especially Mobil and Castrol) are not made public so that makes for some terrible comparisions when all the relative stuff is unknown. Unfortuneately they haven't updated them since 2003, but still is interesting nonetheless. Hell, using his formula and current oil specs, I've ranked a few oils I've considered.

I guess I'm at a toss up here. I've been good with the havoline dino and glad to hear someone else complimenting havoline as a good oil. I thought for the hell of it I'd try the maxlife and see if oil consumption changes at all. No blue smoke, just some oil in the pcv and breather hoses. Damn DC for not properly baffling the valve covers on their motors. that and the slight seepage at the back of the pan, that I'm more than convinced now that it is the pan and has to do with the car facing up hills.
 

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froggy81500 said:
No blue smoke, just some oil in the pcv and breather hoses. Damn DC for not properly baffling the valve covers on their motors. that and the slight seepage at the back of the pan, that I'm more than convinced now that it is the pan and has to do with the car facing up hills.
Exactly the same here. And none of that changed with HM oil (nor should it I guess).
 

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welli work for valvoline, so i would have to say maxlife, or maxlife synthetic
 

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Discussion Starter #12
va3ux said:
Castrol GTX HM is a good example of this. GTX HM also contains higher levels of additives than regular GTX. On BITOG, the general consensus is that Castrol GTX HM dino is probably the best HM dino there is, and that is based on used oil analysis and anecdotal evidence by many users. .
Funny about that general concensus on BITOG about Castrol GTX HM. Happen to notice the ad at the top of the page or the one listed in the "sponsors" link? I'm not dissing the BITOG site but its hard to ignore when there's an ad for the Castrol on the page.
 

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I've been using Castrol GTX HM on my 162,xxx miled SHO - works great. I've noticed it doesn't cough blue smoke anymore on cold starts.
 

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is it safe to go from Mobil-1 full synthetic 5W-30 to regular valvoline max life 5W-30 stuff with out any oil leaks or anything like that?, I know before I throw in a motor into my car< Im changing out the front main oil seal, rear main oil seal, oil pan gasket, and maybe, maybeee the valve cover gaskets w/spark plug tube seals, anybody wanna comment on this?
 

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I don't know what other differences there are between HM oils and others, but the one I'm aware of is seal swellers. The main reason you guys don't see any improvement in leaking is because these days the seals aren't cork, sythetic rubber, etc like they used to be. Those would benefit. Today seals are mostly RTV, which won't be affected.
 

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I was just l;ooking on the Valvoline site at different oils, that full syntec looks and seems to be the best overall, and better than mobil 1, ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #17
CluelessinMO said:
I don't know what other differences there are between HM oils and others, but the one I'm aware of is seal swellers. The main reason you guys don't see any improvement in leaking is because these days the seals aren't cork, sythetic rubber, etc like they used to be. Those would benefit. Today seals are mostly RTV, which won't be affected.
Yes that is true. In some applications and in some areas there's no gaskets or seals just rtv. There was no valve cover gasket on my wife's '92 Saturn only black RTV is what they listed for it. We have an oil pan gasket on the 2.7, however rtv is used at the front where the pan meets the timing cover and at the back near the seal, so I would have to agree with your assessment that seal conditioners will probably do nothing in those areas. But rtv isn't supposed to harden, crack or shrink either, so in all honesty, there shouldn't be any leaks from rtv'd areas.

On a side note, I'm thinking of staying with the regular havoline and possibly adding a small amount of valvoline synpower oil additive. That stuff has an additive package like nothing else. Moly like you wouldn't believe. I've searched for VOA's on the stuff and see a lot of people saying not to dump the entire 15 oz bottle but to use a few ounces at a time.

Big thanks for any and all the input in this thread. Anybody else with more to add, gladly post.
 

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froggy81500 said:
Funny about that general concensus on BITOG about Castrol GTX HM. Happen to notice the ad at the top of the page or the one listed in the "sponsors" link? I'm not dissing the BITOG site but its hard to ignore when there's an ad for the Castrol on the page.
They aren't related from what I can see. Castrol takes it's fair share of bashing on BITOG.

The only way the Castrol company (or any oil company) could positively influence opinion on BITOG is if they provided "data" or inside insights into their products. There's mostly a scientifically-minded group of subscribers on BITOG that believe in data and hate hype. That means UOA and pictures, and/or comments from 2 or 3 true oil experts on the board. They're all leery of advertisers claims and hype.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
va3ux said:
They aren't related from what I can see. Castrol takes it's fair share of bashing on BITOG.

The only way the Castrol company (or any oil company) could positively influence opinion on BITOG is if they provided "data" or inside insights into their products. There's mostly a scientifically-minded group of subscribers on BITOG that believe in data and hate hype. That means UOA and pictures, and/or comments from 2 or 3 true oil experts on the board.
I'm not implying that there might be some influence by Castrol as a paid advertiser. I just thought it ironic that Castrol gets high regards and they have ad space there. If you look at any site with Amsoil ad space, every one of them go on proclaiming Amsoil as the best oil with graphs and stuff. I think there's loads of good data at BITOG. Its a good idea for a site. I'd like to see a nice database of VOA's on a wide variety of oils (synthetics, dinos, additives, high mileage, etc..). And a sticky that gives some detail on what the different additives and metals in an oil do, like moly and calcium, etc.. But of course on a limited budget, it takes time to get that stuff. One thing I liked at another oil forum that I think would be nice to see at BITOG is a ranking system. This is another oil forum I stumbled upon awhile back. Unfortunately the data hasn't been updated since 2003 on the pdf at the bottom of the thread. http://www.themotoroilsite.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=250&

Now if Bob could do something similiar on his site, that'd be awesome. He's got lots of info and if it could be compiled similar to that pdf and he could create a ranking algorythm and ranking system and rank oils based on the data from their VOA's.

UOA's are pretty good info, but there's only so much that can be obtained from them if its not your engine the oil came out of since they are pretty much specific to the engine they were obtained from. Which leads me to another idea. If bob could compile UOA data from specific brands and weights of oils and piles those into a spreadsheet or some other data table. For instance, take all the UOA's for Havoline 5W-30 regardless of what vehicle it came out of or mileage or anything else. Take all those UOA's and put them into a table that can be analyzed. Perhaps such an analysis would show some common characteristics of how this specific oil does in different applications. Generalizations could be made from such data analysis. do many of the vehicles using this oil show more wear metals, or other things that could be an indication of the quality of the oil. This type of analysis of UOA's would be more useful than just specific UOA's from specific vehicles.

Feel free to pass these ideas along to BITOG. I think many members there would be interested in some of what I've described in this post. Pass my name along with it, so if someone wanted to get in touch with me for some more thoughts on this, I'm happy to share some ideas. I'm not a statistician so building and analyzing tables isn't something I'd be useful with, but some thoughts on what might be useful and such.


va3ux said:
They're all leery of advertisers claims and hype.
As they should be. As we all should be.
 

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froggy81500 said:
On a side note, I'm thinking of staying with the regular havoline and possibly adding a small amount of valvoline synpower oil additive. That stuff has an additive package like nothing else. Moly like you wouldn't believe. I've searched for VOA's on the stuff and see a lot of people saying not to dump the entire 15 oz bottle but to use a few ounces at a time. .
I haven't seen the Valvoline additive. Where do you get it? I'm a big fan of Moly; it's the only friction modifier that really works. I used Schaeffer oil, which has moly added, for years until it became too hard to find.
A little aside on Havoline: It cut consumption on my friend's '92 Caravan from a qt/900 mi to a qt/ 1300 mi or so. The 900 miles/qt was on Pennzoil. 10W-30 in for the Pennzoil, 5W-30 for the Havoline. Might have been a little bigger improvement if the havoline had been 10W-30.
 
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