[eagle4x]

I started another thread about a battery drain, and I think a possible cause is a faulty ignition switch on my 2001 Intrepid, and besides I lost the chip key anyway, so I'm looking at replacing some ignition components instead of having a new key programmed. I'm starting this new thread because of more specific questions about the ignition.

I have a pass (valet) key for the vehicle that will open all locks on vehicle but will not start the car.

I asked the part#'s of switch and module:

Switch: 5003843AB

Immobiliizer Module: 04602273AB

I also asked:

1) Will pass key will turn ignition switch in order to remove it, and reply was yes.

2) If I replaced the switch and module at same time with new from their parts dept. would the keys that come with the switch have to be programmed? Reply was yes.

3) If I bought a new switch and a used module, would the keys that came with the switch need to be programmed? Reply was yes.

4) If I bought a used switch with key and used module (from same vehicle) from a salvage yard, would the key have to be programmed to be used on my vehicle? Reply was no.

5) If buy a used switch with key and module from same vehicle from salvage that is same generation as my vehicle, would it be compatible with my vehicle, or would it have to be same year? Reply was same generation would work.

Regarding #3, The rep. at the dealer said if I purchased a new switch/key, i could install a used module only if was erased...anyone know any sources on either where erased modules can be purchased, or names of companies that could erase them?

Regarding #5, The rep. sounded unsure in her reply if used switch/module from any vehicle for my generation (2nd) would be compatible with my car...would I need one from a 2001 Intrepid, or would any year Intrepid or other year similar model like 300m/Concorde/LHS, etc. work, as long as 2nd gen? And does any portion of VIN# need to be the same regardless of year or if Dodge / Chrysler as long as 2nd gen?

 

[Ronbo]

Why aren't you just buying a couple of Sentry key blanks off Ebay or Amazon and having a locksmith program them? Seems like trying to replace some SKIS components and you'll have to program them anyway.

The only way to get around that is to get a PCM/SKIM/Ignition keys all out of the same car and it'll have to be a 2001 because of the PCM. If you replace just one component then programming is required anyway.

 

[aerofxr]

Good info anyway.

 

[eagle4x]

It costs about $250 ($225 programming $25 key) for mobile locksmith to do it and $150 for dealer. If dealer, the car would have to be towed to them, but it could be towed at no charge with my AAA membership, and save some $ if I provide sentry key blanks.

However, I'd hate to incur that expense and turns out the ignition switch and module needs to be replaced to fix the battery drain issue anyway. I plan on going to the salvage yard tomorrow...I've seen some treps there with key in switches and maybe I'll find one with key/switch/module.

From my research, one symptom of a battery taking longer to drain one day vs another (which happened with my trep) could be caused by faulty switch/module.

Questions:
1) You said that only the ignition parts from a 2001 would be compatible with my car...do you mean only a 2001 Intrepid, or would a 2001 Concorde, LHS, 300m be compatible?

2) Is there anything about the VIN for a 2001 that would have to be similar to mine and/or would it have to be the same size engine or model (ES, etc.)?

3) Is the SKIM you referred to the immobilizer module inside the steering column? If not, what is it?

4) If I either find/install used key/switch/module from salvage yard or have dealer program a key, but the battery drain still persists, what is your opinion of installing this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07LGCY3RR/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza

 

[Ronbo]

The SKIM module is in the steering column. It has the antenna ring that goes around the ignition lock cylinder.

The ignition switch (electrical part) can be replaced separate from the lock cylinder. Why not change that first?

Your current draw issue is either the ignition switch or a electrical module not going to sleep. I doubt it's the PCM or TCM. Most likely the BCM or something communicating with the BCM that won't let it go to sleep. You said the interior lights came on by themselves while sitting in the car. Find out what triggered that event. Headlight switch, door switch, whatever.

Changing any one of the PCM/SKIM/Ignition keys will require programming. The PCM has to have your VIN programmed in it and the SKIM has to be programmed to the PCM along with the SKIM PIN, etc.

Buy some blanks, tow the car to the dealer and have them cut/program the keys. Without it running what good is speculating about the PCM being bad?

And if you get two keys programmed....you'll be able to program additional keys yourself in the future after the blanks are cut.

 

[eagle4x]

The SKIM module is in the steering column. It has the antenna ring that goes around the ignition lock cylinder.

The ignition switch (electrical part) can be replaced separate from the lock cylinder. Why not change that first?

Your current draw issue is either the ignition switch or a electrical module not going to sleep. I doubt it's the PCM or TCM. Most likely the BCM or something communicating with the BCM that won't let it go to sleep. You said the interior lights came on by themselves while sitting in the car. Find out what triggered that event. Headlight switch, door switch, whatever.

Changing the any one of the PCM/SKIM/Ignition keys will require programming. The PCM has to have your VIN programmed in it and the SKIM has to be programmed to the PCM along with the SKIM PIN, etc.

Buy some blanks, tow the car to the dealer and have them cut/program the keys. Without it running what good is speculating about the PCM being bad?

And if you get two keys programmed....you'll be able to program additional keys yourself in the future after the blanks are cut.

1) You wrote "The ignition switch (electrical part) can be replaced separate from the lock cylinder. Why not change that first?"

a) I assume you meant replacing the ignition switch first instead of the lock cylinder first because you said one of the suspects is likely the ignition switch...correct? If so, you wrote in previous post in this thread that if replacing only one component, a key has to be programmed...so what would be the benefit of replacing only an ignition switch?

b) By "ignition switch" are you referring to the mobilizer module that's inside the steering column? If not, what are you referring to?

2) You wrote: "The PCM has to have your VIN programmed in it and the SKIM has to be programmed to the PCM along with the SKIM PIN, etc." So if I find a 2001 with a key/SKIM/cylinder/immobilizer module, does that mean that they wouldn't work in my trep because they have to be programmed to the PCM?

Since there is a good chance it's a component in the ignition system, I thought would be better to replace the components from a salvage yard instead of having car towed to a dealer and spend $ for key/programming and then find out the ignition components need replacing, that is if it's possible based on answers to above. However, I still may have the car towed to a dealer...I'd just like to know the answers before making a decision tomorrow morning.

About the interior lights coming on, I think maybe a door wasn't shut good as sometimes the door on the passenger side I was sitting in when that happened has to be slammed hard to close good...otherwise, I don't know of way to figure out what triggered that event.

 

[Ronbo]

Enough!

The Ignition switch is separate from the lock cylinder. It can be replaced by itself without affecting the lock cylinder and your current keys! It has no programming in it.

If your lock cylinder is that worn and affecting the position of the ignition switch....then replace both! The ignition switch is the electrical part below the ignition lock cylinder that controls what circuits are energized when you put the ignition key in and turn it to Run/Start/ACC!

For 2)...............unless you are replacing all 3 of these from a working donor car. PCM/SKIM/Ignition key at the same time then there is programming involved. No way around it. All 3 matching components from a working donor car.

I'm tired of dealing with you on these questions over and over. If you don't want to follow simple instructions then we're done. You keep jumping all over shot gunning things and not being methodical in troubleshooting. You can either throw a lot of parts and money at this problem or work your way through it logically and cheaply.

If the PCM gets changed...it needs to have the matching original VIN from your car programmed....otherwise all the other SKIM components get thrown off.

If it were me.....

First.....get a working Sentry key programmed so you can start and work with the car 100%
then replace the ignition electrical switch. Part number should be 05014176AA. The last two letters aren't really important and can be different.

Again....I'm done with this if you don't want to follow instructions. This isn't "Rocket Science" and the solution can be found if you follow methodical steps. If you choose to replace a bunch of **** then have at it and don't bother me again!

 

[Ronbo]

Just buy whatever you want! LOL!

 

[Ronbo]

Hell....just replace the PCM/TCM/BCM/ABS/SKIM and anything else you think is necessary!

Don't forget the Trunk Latch!

 

[Ronbo]

The SKIM module is separate from the ignition switch.
The SKIM module reads the chipped Sentry keys. It has a ring antenna that surrounds the ignition lock cylinder that reads the chip in the Sentry Ignition Key. When the SKIM detects a valid Sentry key..it polls the PCM for a valid read and allows the starter to function. No valid Sentry key..no starter. This is why your "Valet" key only unlocks the doors and doesn't allow the car to start. All Sentry keys have Gray plastic heads. Non-Sentry are all Black plastic.
The ignition switch provides power to individual circuits according to where your ignition key is turned.....Start/Run/ACC positions. If your ignition lock cylinder is worn then it may allow the ignition switch portion to move to the "RUN" or "ACC" position energizing circuits that would normally be off with the key out, etc.

Are you seeing the logic behind this?

 

[eagle4x]

The SKIM module is separate from the ignition switch.
The SKIM module reads the chipped Sentry keys. It has a ring antenna that surrounds the ignition lock cylinder that reads the chip in the Sentry Ignition Key. When the SKIM detects a valid Sentry key..it polls the PCM for a valid read and allows the starter to function. No valid Sentry key..no starter. This is why your "Valet" key only unlocks the doors and doesn't allow the car to start. All Sentry keys have Gray plastic heads. Non-Sentry are all Black plastic.
The ignition switch provides power to individual circuits according to where your ignition key is turned.....Start/Run/ACC positions. If your ignition lock cylinder is worn then it may allow the ignition switch portion to move to the "RUN" or "ACC" position energizing circuits that would normally be off with the key out, etc.

Are you seeing the logic behind this?

Yes, I'm seeing the logic behind it.

I found a mobile locksmith with more reasonable prices and decided to go that route instead of hassle of having car towed to dealer.

When I called him he said that he may have to make a phone call to get programming code for the key after he hooked up his equipment and if so, would take longer. I told him the dealer has the key in stock with the key code and programming code, so he said go get the key from the dealer.

I took my car title to the dealer and he cut the key based on the vin#, and he price matched with mopargiants.com. However, the key he cut did not match with my valet key, so he gave me an uncut chip key to give to the locksmith to cut.

After I arrived home, I inserted the key he cut and it did not open any doors/trunk or turn the ignition cylinder.

The locksmith cut the blank the dealer gave me using my valet key, and said from the test on his equipment showed it was incorrect key. I called dealer and was given refund.

The locksmith cut 2 keys from his inventory using my valet key and car started.

I asked why key cut by dealer using vin# did not work and he speculated the previous owner had a problem with the ignition and replaced the cylinder/door locks/truck lock, which seems odd that someone would spend that much money only for the convenience of having the same key fit everything even though there was a remote to open the doors.

I verified the vin# on the paper from the dealer with the key codes was exactly the same as my car title.

After keys cut, I noticed some resistance while removing, so maybe it's starting to fail.

As you suggested, I'll replace ignition switch and I'll also replace the cylinder and get a locksmith to re-key it for the new keys cut. Thanks for your help.

 

[Ronbo]

Hopefully replacing the Ignition Switch & Lock Cylinder will net you positive results. At least it will eliminate them as a possible cause of problems.

Now that you have two working Sentry keys....you can program additional keys yourself. Just buy blanks and get them cut. Then you can follow a procedure to program them without a trip to a dealer or need for a locksmith (other than cutting the key)

 

[Ronbo]

Here's the "Customer Learn" procedure for programming future cut keys. Remember you need two keys already to program more.

CUSTOMER LEARN
(1) Obtain the additional Sentry Key transponder
blank(s) that are to be programmed for the vehicle.
Cut the additional Sentry Key transponder blanks to
match the ignition lock cylinder mechanical key
codes.
(2) Insert one of the two valid Sentry Key transponders
into the ignition switch and turn the ignition
switch to the ON position.
(3) After the ignition switch has been in the ON
position for about three seconds, but no more than
fifteen seconds, cycle the ignition switch back to the
OFF position. Replace the first valid Sentry Key in
the ignition lock cylinder with the second valid Sentry
Key and turn the ignition switch back to the ON
position. Both operations must be performed within
15 seconds.
(4) About ten seconds after the completion of Step
3, the VTSS indicator LED will start to flash and a
single audible chime tone will sound to indicate that
the system has entered the “Customer Learn” programming
mode.
(5) Within about fifty seconds of entering the “Customer
Learn” programming mode, turn the ignition
switch to the OFF position, replace the valid Sentry
Key with a blank Sentry Key transponder, and turn
the ignition switch back to the ON position.
(6) About ten seconds after the completion of Step
5, a single audible chime tone will sound and the
VTSS indicator LED will stop flashing and stay on
solid for about three seconds to indicate that the
blank Sentry Key transponder has been successfully
programmed. The SKIS will immediately return to
normal system operation following exit from the
“Customer Learn” programming mode.
(7) Go back to Step 2 and repeat this process for
each additional Sentry Key transponder blank to be
programmed.
If any of the above steps is not completed in the
proper sequence, or within the allotted time, the
SKIS will automatically exit the “Customer Learn”
programming mode. The SKIS will also automatically
exit the “Customer Learn” programming mode if it
sees a non-blank Sentry Key transponder when it
should see a blank, if it has already programmed
eight valid Sentry Keys, or if the ignition switch is
turned to the OFF position for more than about fifty
seconds.

 

[eagle4x]

Just noticed this on side of steering wheel with a loose electrical lead...anyone know what this is and/or if this could cause battery drain?

 

[Ronbo]

Do you have steering wheel audio controls? If that's on the back cover it looks like the opening for one of the audio controls.

Item #12

 

[Ronbo]

Looks like the buttons got broken off the switch body. You'll need a new switch assembly as noted in my above post. Item # 12 in the pdf.

 

[eagle4x]

Looks like the buttons got broken off the switch body. You'll need a new switch assembly as noted in my above post. Item # 12 in the pdf.

From your diagram, there's one on each side. I'll check it out. Thanks.

 

[Ronbo]

Here's the next page that actually has the part number for the Audio Control Switches.

 

[Ronbo]

Looks like you can get those switches from Amazon for around $24! Expensive. You used to be able to get a whole back cover with switches for around $40. No more!

I doubt that broken switch is contributing to your current drain though. So unless it's needed which it sounds like you didn't know was there then ignore it for now and concentrate on the ignition switch etc.

 

[eagle4x]

Update - ignition switch, light switch w/wheel, climate control:

1) Ignition switch from 2000 Concorde...behind the multi-function switch (wipers/signals).

Even from the removal instructions a friend sent me from FSM, I was not able to remove the multi-function switch (wipers/signals) from car in salvage yard because I didn't have a torx socket to remove the 2 bolts...it has to be removed to access the top nut of the ignition switch, so I busted it off, and then I was able to remove the ignition switch.

2) Light switch / dimmer wheel: Replaced and installed on car yesterday.

3) Climate control (LED): After replacing yesterday, LED lights worked and the fan didn't blow air when turned off as did before.

4) Hooked up CD player that was disconnected.

Car started today. Since the ignition switch difficult to replace, I'll wait to see if replacing #2 and #3 fixed the problem...if not, I'll either replace the ignition switch myself or pay someone to do it. Is it possible to test it with meter, and if so how?

The 2 piece shroud that covers the top part of the steering column is black but dash is tan in my trep. In every car at salvage yard I've seen, the shroud and dash are same color, therefore, leads me to suspect some ignition work done and shroud broken/replaced then.