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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
What do you think?

some of you may remember my hunt to figure out what the annoying popping was. It would happen only from stop to 30mph or so and under half decent acceleration, it would be a VERY loud POP like sound and would continue if you stayed on it... so being no n00b to fixing cars I've attempted a few things, but nothing looked strange and eventually I ended up taking it to a shop... they *think* it's the passender side driveaxle (not the cv-shaft) as according to them it's is very loose inside the transmission.

makes sense?

I'm 99.9% sure of "no", but any way of getting to it relatively easily without having to pull the entire motor/tranny out? (still a possibility btw, I've swapped many motors before and wouldn't mind doing it if I HAD to...).

a nice detailed transmission diagram would help as this is my first FWD car and I'm not sure how the axle is exactly held in place.

thanks in advance for any help you can give me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Oh I'm sorry, I forgot to include the year...

1995 Intrepid ES, I'd really appreciate it if you could send me those diagrams to [email protected]

and while I thought the same thing at first, I have personally changed both CV half shafts (it's the whole assembly from transmission to the wheel, already preassembled for you and much easier to change than just a CV joint), they were brand new units, I put them in myself and the problem didn't change one bit. :(
 

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If you've changed them out before, why do you need diagrams? What exact diagrams do you need?

It was doing this noise before and after the halfshaft replacement?


Really, it's pretty hard for the halfshafts to be loose enough to be noisey. They are setup so they are being clamped inbetween the transmission and the hub, by the front suspension. That is why it doesn't need to be bolted to the transmission. For them to be loose enough to make a noise would require very damaged CV joints.


Ignore what the shop said. Look at the suspension.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
you are misunderstanding me or maybe I'm not being clear enough.

think of this as a little diagram

Wheel hub - halfshaft - axle - transmission - axle - halfshaft - Wheel Hub

according to them the AXLE is loose within the transmission. The halfshafts connect to the axle (that sticks out of the tranny) and go to wheel hubs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
btw the noise was the same before or after I replaced both halfshafts. Something else is making that noise.
 

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By axle, do you mean the shaft inside the transmission itself?

Drive axle usually refers to the halfshaft itself.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
that's true, I wasn't being totally clear.

Yes the shaft that is inside the transmission seems to be the problem. Hence why I needed the diagram to see how it is held in place within the transmission and if ripping the engine/transmission out is an option and worth doing with the intention of rebuilding the transmission myself or replacing it if I had to.
 

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I have the same problem...Did you ever figure out what the noise was. I have a 2002 dodge love car making the same noise after I replaced the half shaft c.f. joint and the wheel bearing. I had the whole front end in the air on jack stands and I started up and took those CV joint off and the wheel bearing the stud turn with no noise I put everything back on brand new and the noise came back. I agree it must be from the stud male end of the shaft that sticks into the the female end of the CV joint half shaft. My issue is with the driver side male stud that comes out of the transmission seems as though the noise is coming from that particular area any clue what that noise is anybody figure it out?
 

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Any resolution to this? I have the same problem with my 04. Passenger side CV is really loose in the trans/differential. No clunking but it howls on the highway.

I'm assuming it's the differential bearing, but I'm kind of hoping this doesn't require removing the transmission from the car.
 

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howling is more probable of a wheel bearing.
if this was loose and flopping it would give a vibration.
and if it's the axle, it's time fora new one.

but if it is a differential bearing, you might get it from the side cover of the case.
but i've yet to see it be the problem, but theres always a first time.
there is a bearing on the drivers dide that might need replacing.

are you only thinking the sound is coming from there because of the play?
 

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howling is more probable of a wheel bearing.
if this was loose and flopping it would give a vibration.
and if it's the axle, it's time fora new one.

but if it is a differential bearing, you might get it from the side cover of the case.
but i've yet to see it be the problem, but theres always a first time.
there is a bearing on the drivers dide that might need replacing.

are you only thinking the sound is coming from there because of the play?
Yes. It sounds like the noise is from the passenger front and I grabbed that CV and my jaw dropped. That said after some research, apparently this massive amount of play is normal and there to help torque steer?

The noise I have is kind of odd. The reason I looked there is because I could only think it was something in the diff. It comes and goes consistently as I drive on the highway every second or two. On throttle I can hear it, let off and it seems to go away. It's not super loud, but my steering wheel does shake a bit (this could be tires or any multitude of things). I hate to even call it a howl, it sounds like a combination of a bad bearing and tire noise, but its's not consistent to tire revolutions which is throwing me off. Diff fluid is about 1/4 below the fill plug and there is only very minor seepage at the CV/diff seal. Fluid in the diff is clean, not burnt.
 

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I would suggest that noise that changes with application and removal of acceleration torque is an indication of a bad axle inner CV joint (DOJ). As you mentioned, the seemingly large radial play in the transmission stub shaft is normal due to the way the differential and shaft support system is constructed (I will find and post information on why that is following this post). It would take some very rare failure conditions inside the differential to be causing abnormal noises - more than likely a bad inner CV joint as already said.
 

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Below is a post from a previous thread explaining the seemingly-large-but normal play in the passenger-side transmission stub shaft. You may (or may not) find other posts in the thread interesting - in particular, one guy didn't believe the explanation, and actually completely rebuilt the differential with all new bearings, etc., only to find that the same play was there with all new and properly adjusted parts. Basically, if you were to check a brand new LH car from the factory, it would have had the same play in that shaft. :)


(post number 11 here: Transmission swap reprogram)
Below is a blowup of the differential. The short shaft (3) is the passenger side. Notice that the carrier is supported on bearings (22 & 23). The inboard ends of both shafts plug into the pinion gears (9), and the shafts float in bushings (7 & 14) not far from the pinions. Notice that the driver's side (long) shaft (20) has additional support of a bearing (19) in the tranny case near its outboard end. The only support the short shaft has is the bushing and the pinion gear - and at very close spacing. That's why the short shaft seems to move around a lot more than the driver's side shaft when you shake it with your hands.

(Realize that the differential carrier is rotating with the shafts on straight and level driving. Only when you turn a corner is there very small speed difference between the shafts and their bushings (differential action) - so the bushings and shafts don't see much wear, but they do have some clearance play from the factory.)

 

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Yes. It sounds like the noise is from the passenger front and I grabbed that CV and my jaw dropped. That said after some research, apparently this massive amount of play is normal and there to help torque steer?...
I'm not seeing it as having anything to do with intentionally being there to counteract torque steer. I see it as having everything to do with the normal play in the shaft support bushing - item 7 in the blowup diagram (vs. a pre-loaded or otherwise zero-play bearing) amplified by the very short length of the shaft. I'm not at all saying you're wrong, but I'm not seeing it. If you have an explanation about the torque steer, I'd be interested to hear it and to learn.
 

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Yes. It sounds like the noise is from the passenger front and I grabbed that CV and my jaw dropped. That said after some research, apparently this massive amount of play is normal and there to help torque steer?

The noise I have is kind of odd. The reason I looked there is because I could only think it was something in the diff. It comes and goes consistently as I drive on the highway every second or two. On throttle I can hear it, let off and it seems to go away. It's not super loud, but my steering wheel does shake a bit (this could be tires or any multitude of things). I hate to even call it a howl, it sounds like a combination of a bad bearing and tire noise, but its's not consistent to tire revolutions which is throwing me off. Diff fluid is about 1/4 below the fill plug and there is only very minor seepage at the CV/diff seal. Fluid in the diff is clean, not burnt.
yes, normal, but it's not for torque steer.
just something inherent in the design.

could very well be an axle, with the noise on acceleration relieving with deceleration.
just wanted to steer you away from the diff just because. (y)
time to get the wheels off the ground and go discovering.
get some cv boot straps or good zip ties and open the boots if you have to.
give your motor and tranny mount a check while your under.
 
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