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Discussion Starter #1
At the risk of sounding retarded, what they hell fluid are we supposed to use in these things anyway? Its a 2001 SE w/ 2.7L. The cap says see manual or something. The owners manual says do not used transmissin fluid, see dealer for appropriate fluid. The FSM on here (which is for 2002) states in bold to use ATF +4 in the power steering. And I read at least one post where they too have used ATF +4. So what should it be? I'll pick some up in the morning on the way to work.
 

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If your trep came with ATF4 then use it if not use normal DOT 3(I think, or am I confusing it with the brake fluid I changed also :twak: ) power steering fluid. I changed my power steering fluid not too long ago, I didn't have ATF in it so I didn't bother with it, just a good quality not the cheapest power steering fluid.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
So far I came across a TSB regarding this that some DC vehicles were switched over to use ATF +4 in the p/s systems. I searched yahoo and actually found a thread on here that also mentioned it. Damn thing doesn't really say if ATF+4 can be mixed with whatever might in there now. Says the factory fill on an '01 is MS9933. No idea how to find out what p/s fluid is compatible.
 

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Just get a couple of bottles and do a flush and fill. My fluid was looking brownish-black it was so dirty. I sucked the old fluid out filled with new, turned on the car gave the steering a couple of lock to lock, went back sucked the other black stuff, refilled with clean fluid. Had to do this several times until the fluid looked almost clear, obviously it will turn brownish again but that's bcs of the rubber hoses and at least now I know the fluid is new.
I have heard about the +4 being used sometimes but unless your vehicle came with it then you shouldn't use it. The fluid I used was just normal power steering fluid an haven't had any problems as of today, actually the steering feels smoother.
 

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The Scoop on Power Steering Fluids and What to Use

There is a lot of confusion regarding "what the heck is the fluid to service my
power steering fluid with. Answer: It depends. I'll break it down, based on Chrysler's information.

Three Power Steering fluids have been used in Second Generation LH cars. Model year 1998 LH had one fluid (MS5931), Model 1999 LH started another fluid (MS9933), and later this fluid too was superceded by MS9602 (ATF+4). My '99 Factory Service manual explicity says not to use ATF+4 (MS9602) transmission fluid in the power steering system (but read on). Later, Chrysler approved ATF+4 for factory fill for these cars. A TSB indicates that future fluid replacement for existing fluids should be done with ATF+4 -but-but-but an older fluid must be *completely* removed as ATF+4 should not be mixed with MS5931. MS9933 is compatible with MS9602 (ATF+4) and apparently any cars originally filled with MS9933 should be topped off with MS9602. (While researching this I discovered that my own steering fluid change for my 1999 was refilled with MS5931--uh oh.)

ATF+4 is a synthetic fluid with a lot of good properties for transmissions, and they probably eventually decided that this fluid was great for steering as well. Although the friction modifiers etc for the transmission are probably overkill for a steering fluid, this permits one fewer part to stock, but no harm at all. Just my speculation. MS9933 turned out to be an interim fluid.

I'll have to dig up the TSBs (there are several) which lists exact fluids and dates that models were switched (some were in the middle of model years to make it confusing).

UPDATE: I just found the relevant TSBs. If you don't want the history, just skip down to 19-005-03.

TSB # 19-06-98 Issued Oct 2 1998 (now superceded) :
Applies to the latest model year of the time, 1999 for LH, JX, JA, PL, PR (prowler), SR (viper)
States that the factory fill power steering fluid was changed for Model Year 1999 from MS5931 to MS9933. "[MS9933] has better properties at low and high end temperatures. The properties of this fluid will also remain more stable as the fluid ages. When servicing these vehicles in which *additional* fluid is required use part number 05010304AA."
Again at the time, my Model Year 99 FSM said *not* to use ATF+4 as steering fluid.
---------------------------------------
Flash forward to the next relevant TSB:

TSB # 19-007-01 Issued Aug 2, 2001 (now superceded)
Can't find this one in my files, but I may have it stored elsewhere. (Usually I still have superceded TSBs but maybe it was indexed incorrectly or deleted.) No matter, it's been superceded by the next TSB.
===============================
-- THIS IS WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW: --
Flash forward to the next relevant TSB:

TSB # 19-005-03 Issued Aug 29, 2003 (I believe this is latest and current info)
This affects *a lot* of Chrysler vehicles, I won't bother listing outside of the LH series. Applies to first and second generation LH, model years 1993-2004.

Paraphrasing:
The factory fill power steering fluid for most 2004 Chrysler group vehicles is ATF+4 (MS9602) and it provides *superior* properties at both low and high temperatures. Refer to the table to identify factory fill and approved service power steering fluid by year and model. Note that MS9602 (aka ATF+4) is Red in color and MS5931 and MS9933 are Amber/Yellow in color. All 3 will darken with age and color is not indicator of fluid condition.

The part numbers for MS9602 are 05013457AA (quart) and 05013458AA (gallon). The part number for MS5931 is 04883077 (quart). The part number for MB345 [BELIEVE THAT IS CHRYSLER TYPO] is 05127381AA.

[Ok now the most important part:]

MS9602 should not be used as a "topping off" fluid on systems requiring MS5931. On some past models, MS9602 should be used as the replacement fluid. On these models, if a power steering system is being serviced that involves a large fluid loss, such as a pump, hose or rack replacement, the complete system should be drained and refilled with MS9602.

NOTE: This bulletin supercedes owner's/service manuals which may state to use MS9933 in the power steering system, and that may state not to use automatic transmission fluid in the power steering system.

Table
[skipping non LH models]



  • LH 1993-1997 Factory Fill: MS5931 Top-Off service with: MS5931
  • LH 1998-2001 Factory Fill: MS9933 Top-Off service with: MS9602
  • LH 2002-2004 Factory Fill: MS9602 Top-Off service with: MS9602.
[clearly if a 1993-1997 LH vehicle was completely replaced with MS9602, it should continue to be serviced with MS9602.]

I hope somebody finds it useful! I remember learning this before, but sorting it out for this post helped me too.

Edited: Added markups and list to make post more readable.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Yeah, I came across most of that already. Mine's an '01 so from what I can figure it was factory filled with ms9933. The TSB says not to top off systems with ATF+4 (ms9602) that had ms5931 (which I don't have) but doesn't clearly indicate whether ATF+4 can be used to top off ms9933. That's really where my confusion lies. So far all the p/s fluids I've researched meet ms5391 requirements, which I don't want. ATF+4 I can find as long as I can top off with it. I really only need a few ounces, but if its better I would actually go as far as using a squeeze bulb to pull some old fluid out and add some fresh ATF+4 to it. Thanks for the input thus far IntrepidDrvier99. Hopefully you can answer the "topping off" mystery. And anybody else that's mixed ATF with the factory fill, please chime in to any good or bad that could be expected.
 

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froggy81500 said:
Yeah, I came across most of that already. Mine's an '01 so from what I can figure it was factory filled with ms9933. The TSB says not to top off systems with ATF+4 (ms9602) that had ms5931 (which I don't have) but doesn't clearly indicate whether ATF+4 can be used to top off ms9933. That's really where my confusion lies. .
Hi Froggy, if you read TSB 19-005-03 Issued Aug 29, 2003 above, it explicity states that MS9933 cars should be topped off/serviced with MS9602 (ATF+4). I'm not even sure if Chrysler still makes spec 9933 anymore. HTH!
 

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Hmm, mines a combination of whatever I had in the garage and whatever they put in when the radiator was replaced. I think I'm going to do like termiantor said and replace all the fluid. If I do that, I should probably use ATF+4, right?
 

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i replaced mine when i had the power steering cooling line crack on me. i used valvoline synthetic and have had zero problems. that was last year and about 20-30K miles ago.
 

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Don't just suck it out o fthe reservoir. Remove the return line from the rack and pinion from under the pump and suck it out with a hand operated vacuum pump. Or at least drain it out with gravity. The pump and rack will hold a bunch of fluid that will not mix with some of the replacement fluids.
 
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