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I dunno.... i never go around the car five times with Zaino. I'll clean with dawn.... then use Z1 and then Z2. I dont even bother with Z5 since I have a silver car and swirl marks are not as big an issue.

If i go around with the spray... which i do often... it doesnt take very long since its a quick spray on/wipe off deal.
 

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Well, there is sort of a flaw with his test. He never polished the paint on the Meguiar's side, which is what trully removes/hides swirl marks. All he did was "clean" the paint and then wax it. I think he would have seen better results if he had applied Meguiar's #9 Swirl Remover or #7 Show Car Glaze before the Gold Class wax. Both can be applied by hand, not requiring a buffer and I've found they make an incredible difference in vissible swirl marks and color depth...
 

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Discussion Starter #4
dbaudiopro said:
Well, there is sort of a flaw with his test. He never polished the paint on the Meguiar's side, which is what trully removes/hides swirl marks. All he did was "clean" the paint and then wax it. I think he would have seen better results if he had applied Meguiar's #9 Swirl Remover or #7 Show Car Glaze before the Gold Class wax. Both can be applied by hand, not requiring a buffer and I've found they make an incredible difference in vissible swirl marks and color depth...
Hey dbaudiopro,
Questions... You obviously know more than me concerning the products that Meguiar's offers. I've been using the Meguiar's 3-part crystal system which comprises the cleaner, polish and wax. I've liked the results on my Black Trep, but I think I can do better. I just bought a random orbital polisher for I'm truly tired of doing anything by hand. I need to cut the time down. I've yet to use it, but will shortly to apply a fresh layer of wax. Which brings me to my next point. I've decided to replace the wax portion of the Meguiar's 3-part crystal system with the Meguiar's Gold Class Clear Coat Liquid Car Wax, believing this will perform even better. I have purchased it, but not yet used it, but when I do, I'll likely use the new electric polisher.

Now, my question(s):

I'm just using the no-brainer 3-part system that Meguiar's sells, yet there is a whole slew of the more professional products they offer that are available, just like the choices you've indicated above. Okay, now the big question: What products within the Meguiar's professional line might you recommend for me and my new, black R/T? Obviously the paint in in PERFECT shape right now, and I want to keep it that way. Very few swirl marks, but a couple... I think the cleaner/polish/wax idea is good, and performing 3 steps doesn't bother me much.

Sure would appreciate your thoughts. Thanks...
 

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Hope you don't mind if I jump in...

You probably can avoid using the cleaner for now...I would say limit it to once a year for the first few years...your paint/clearcoat should be nearly perfect on a brand new car...no need to clean it very often at this point. Probably clean once after the winter months. With my new trep I have been using Show Car Glaze 7 and Hi-Tech Yellow Wax 26...the Gold Class Clear Coat Car Wax should be a fine replacement for the 26.

Mequiars basically recommends 5 steps: Wash, Surface Prep/cleaning, Polishing, Protecting/wax, maintaining.

My opinion...with a new car you can avoid or limit the surface prep/cleaning for now. Stick with a good polish that you use maybe 6 times a year (I would say less but with a black car you definitely need to polish a little more often) and then wax maybe 8-12 times a year depending on the environmental conditions (heat, rain, snow, garaged/not garaged etc...)

Check out their web site...there are a lot of pro products but you really will not go wrong with any of them. Just pick one from each catagory.

http://www.meguiars.com/product_showroom/showroom_template.cfm

Congrats on your new buffer...personally I would spend a buck or two more and go with the professional products. In a perfect world I would suggest...New Car Glaze 5 or Show Car Glaze 7 for your polish, and Hi-Tech Yellow Wax 26 or Medallion Premium Paint Protection for your wax. Also might consider Polymer Sealant for the summer months if you park outdoors.

I love black cars...if it would have been my choice alone my Trep would be black but had to compromise and ended up with Inferno Red. Black cars look the absolute best when well maintained.
 

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BTW...personally I would avoid the Crystal line from Meguiars. I used to use them but was never really impressed with results. I think the pro products are a lot better.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
ChicagoTRS said:
BTW...personally I would avoid the Crystal line from Meguiars. I used to use them but was never really impressed with results. I think the pro products are a lot better.
Hey, thanks a lot Chicago! I'm learning a lot from you guys!

Thanks to you, I did research and purchase a random orbital polisher. I was most impressed with the Porter Cable 7424 or 7336 random orbital polisher/sander. They can be had new on EBAY or Yahoo Shopping for about $120.00. Along with pads, etc. the price would go up to around $200.00. Interestingly enough, this is the very polisher that Meguiar's recommends and sells on their web site for $250.00, without pads! Hmmm. I also looked at numerous other units from Wen, Makita, Milwaukee Tool, and others.

So, after much research & education what did I do? I went out and blew my money on a cheaper unit. Actually, check this out. I decided to go by Sears and see what they had. I wasn't real impressed with their products while looking at their web site, but I figured "what the hell", stop by and check 'em out. Well, they had/have this 10" random orbital polisher on special, complete with a bunch of bonnets and a carry case, all for $39.95. I just couldn't pass it up. It's a Craftsman, so I figure it'll hold up okay. And besides, it'll probably do just great on this new cars finish. Even so, if I don't like it, back into the box it goes and back to Sears for a refund. Actually, after getting it home and checking it out, I think it'll work just great for me. $200.00 compared to $40.00 - I'll try the $40 solution first...

Here's the one I got from Sears:

http://www.sears.com/sr/product/summary/[email protected]@@@[email protected]@@@&BV_EngineID=ccheadcfljekdhfcehgcemgdffmdfin.0&vertical=SEARS&bidsite=&pid=00910626000

Also, I agree with you Chicago. I expected the Crystal system to perform better. I did go over and look at the professional products, and I too kind of keyed in on the New Car Glaze as a polish and the Hi-Tech Yellow Wax as the top coat. Question: Where are you coming up with the numbers after the product name?

Thanks again all, especially you Chicago! I'll keep you guys updated...
 

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If you look at the pro products bottles they all have numbers on them. Since there are so many pro products makes it a little easier to refer to them just by number.

I think you will be pretty happy with the $40 buffer. I did the exact same thing...I own a $50 unit. I figure it this buffer ever dies then maybe I will go for a little better one. Wanted to try it out first and see how I liked using it. I still only use the buffer about 50% of the time. Still do it by hand when all I am looking for is a quick wax or focused wax on just the hood and spoiler.
 

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Snorton Norton said:


Hey dbaudiopro,
Questions... You obviously know more than me concerning the products that Meguiar's offers. I've been using the Meguiar's 3-part crystal system which comprises the cleaner, polish and wax. I've liked the results on my Black Trep, but I think I can do better. I just bought a random orbital polisher for I'm truly tired of doing anything by hand. I need to cut the time down. I've yet to use it, but will shortly to apply a fresh layer of wax. Which brings me to my next point. I've decided to replace the wax portion of the Meguiar's 3-part crystal system with the Meguiar's Gold Class Clear Coat Liquid Car Wax, believing this will perform even better. I have purchased it, but not yet used it, but when I do, I'll likely use the new electric polisher.

Now, my question(s):

I'm just using the no-brainer 3-part system that Meguiar's sells, yet there is a whole slew of the more professional products they offer that are available, just like the choices you've indicated above. Okay, now the big question: What products within the Meguiar's professional line might you recommend for me and my new, black R/T? Obviously the paint in in PERFECT shape right now, and I want to keep it that way. Very few swirl marks, but a couple... I think the cleaner/polish/wax idea is good, and performing 3 steps doesn't bother me much.

Sure would appreciate your thoughts. Thanks...
I've used lots of Meguiar's products on my car all with varying degrees of success. I used the Deep Crystal system for about two years on my old car and loved it. I got tons of complements on it (yes it was black). This was all while I was on a starving college student budget so the Deep Crystal line was in my price range. However, once using the professional stuff I won't go back. I have had much better results. I own the Meguiar's Dual Action Polisher. I bought it when it was brand new and before I realized it was just a Porter Cable piece that I could have bought cheaper. I got it so new that Meguiar's wasn't even repackaging it in the Meguiar's box it was still in the Porter Cable box and the Meguiar's stickers were just stuck over top the Porter Cable ones on the unit itself! :) However, I got it as part of their Concours Collection, so if you average out the savings it wasn't that bad. BTW: their collections are definitley the way to get started, you can save a ton of money. I typically spend about $200 a year on Meguiar's products for the car, but I use everything. I don't believe there is a non-Meguiar's product that touches my car, including the brushes and wash mits, etc. (I don't find their wash mits and stuff to be that overpriced and they all came with the kit I bought anyway). The only non Meguiar's product I use is Simple Green, but I may switch to their new all purpose cleaner.

One word of advice on the power polisher. I don't feel comfortable using anything other than a foam pad (which is all that workd with the polisher I have). The lambs wool and terry cloth will all easilly leave swirl marks and worse, buffer marks, if used improperly. With how contoured our cars are it's easy to create buffer marks. I'm not sure what your buffer came with, but I would recommend "closed cell foam" pads for those of us that aren't trained pros.

Right now my car is covered in swirls and buffer marks because I got lazy a couple months ago and took it to a local detail shop. The shop came highly recommended and they only use Meguiar's products, but they did a shitty job and now I'm going to spend hours upon hours getting it cleaned up. It goes to show that even with the best materials you can screw stuff up not knowing what you're doing... :mad:
 

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ChicagoTRS said:
Hope you don't mind if I jump in...

You probably can avoid using the cleaner for now...I would say limit it to once a year for the first few years...your paint/clearcoat should be nearly perfect on a brand new car...no need to clean it very often at this point. Probably clean once after the winter months. With my new trep I have been using Show Car Glaze 7 and Hi-Tech Yellow Wax 26...the Gold Class Clear Coat Car Wax should be a fine replacement for the 26.

Mequiars basically recommends 5 steps: Wash, Surface Prep/cleaning, Polishing, Protecting/wax, maintaining.

My opinion...with a new car you can avoid or limit the surface prep/cleaning for now. Stick with a good polish that you use maybe 6 times a year (I would say less but with a black car you definitely need to polish a little more often) and then wax maybe 8-12 times a year depending on the environmental conditions (heat, rain, snow, garaged/not garaged etc...)
I would disagree with this about not cleaning the paint surface on a new car. Unfortunately, our cars don't get covered delivery and typically pick up a lot of crap during transportation. The first thing I did to my new R/T was wash it and feel the surface. It was rough as hell, so I used the clay bar on it, cleaned it with Medallion paint cleaner, polished with #7 and finished it off with some Medallion Premium Paint Protection. It was awsome when I was done. When I took it into the dealership the next week to have the spoiler put on, they were amazed at the finish.

Also, I used to wash and wax my car on a weekly basis. I would use #7 on it monthly to bi-monthly and paint cleaner at least every 3-4 months. However, I now have a life and my car finsih has suffered a little. I'm now lucky to get her washed twice a month... :(
 

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They have a nice deal going on at Target right now...have 2 different Meguiars Gift Packs on clearance.

9.99 gift pack includes: Gold Class Wax(10.99), Gold Class CarWash(5.99), Spray on Detailer (4.99), and Scratch X(6.99). $29 value.

6.99 gift pack included: one each of their wipes leather/protectant/all purpose normally 5.99 ea.

Not sure if they are available at all stores but they are here...didn't buy any because I use all pro products but definitely great deals.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
dbaudiopro said:
One word of advice on the power polisher. I don't feel comfortable using anything other than a foam pad (which is all that workd with the polisher I have). The lambs wool and terry cloth will all easilly leave swirl marks and worse, buffer marks, if used improperly. With how contoured our cars are it's easy to create buffer marks. I'm not sure what your buffer came with, but I would recommend "closed cell foam" pads for those of us that aren't trained pros.
Alright, well damn it anyways dbaudiopro!

Man, after reading your statement above your words just kept nagging at me. Swirl marks. Closed cell foam.

As I continued to research your words made more and more sense. I found some real good tutorials out there, as well as user opinions and suggestions and the real believable testimonials always pointed to the foam pads as the goof-proof way to go (when attached to a random orbital polisher).

Okay, so I look at the Sears unit I picked up (but haven't used yet), and after doing a little more research I find that there isn't any type of foam pad product available for it (my biggest concern). That's my fist problem with the Sears unit. Two, I don't like the fact that the Sears unit allows the application pad to shift around while in use. Three, I don't like the fact that the pad is 10" in diameter. Too darn big to get into the smaller areas as compared to say a 6" pad. Four, I don't like the fact that the you really can't use the edge of the pads to get into smaller areas, for the pads are really only usable on the face portion, not the edge portion.

So, needless to say, the Sears unit is re-packed up and going back tomorrow. Instead, I got what I knew was going to be the exact right unit for me and my needs, the Porter Cable Random Orbit Polisher. It's "the" unit to beat as I see it. Purchased it today off EBAY for $115.00 new with "But It Now".

That handles the unit, now for pads, etc. Well, as I did my research on foam pads, I found three different products available out there that are created just for the Porter Cable polisher. The first being Meguire's Softbuff cutting, polishing and finishing foam pads, here:

http://www.meguiars.com/product_showroom/showproducts_template.cfm?SrcLine=PT&SrcCat=0

Also found is the Durofoam variable contact foam pads and Viper Microfiber Bonnet from Classic Motoring Accessories, here:

http://www.properautocare.com/porcabac.html

And finially, the Orange Foam Polishing Pad, Red Foam Waxing Pad and the micro fiber wax removal bonnet from Groit's Garage, here:

http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?SKUupsell=10626
http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?SKUupsell=10628
http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?SKUupsell=11536


As I've read through all these products, here's what I think I'd like to do. I'll give it a couple days before ordering to read any comments from you folks.

I like the Durofoam variable contact foam pads and Viper Microfiber Bonnet products from Classic Motoring Accessories. Here's what I'm likely to purchase:

Qty. 1) 6 inch Velcro Backup Plate - all pads below are velcro receivers
Qty. 2) White Polishing Pad - Surface cleaning and polishing
Qty. 1) Grey Finishing Pad - Wax application
Qty. 3) 6 inch Viper Microfiber Bonnet - product removal of cleaner, polish and wax
Qty. 1) 6 inch Lambswool Leveling Pad - for use under the 6 inch Viper Microfiber Bonnet

I like the above items because they are all matched to one another, and the fact that I want to be able to use the polisher to remove hazed product as well as buff the finish by using the Viper Microfiber Bonnet, and not by hand/terry cloth towel (something that the Meguiare's line does not yet have).

I assume that products from these three sources are "closed cell" foam products. I hear this term used, yet none of the manufacturers call it by that name in the product descriptions. They all just say "foam". Am I okay with the products from these three manufacturers for the most part?

Yeah, more expensive for sure. Just about $200.00 for the whole outfit, but I really believe it will pay for itself in time saved and keeping the black color looking its best.

Any and all comments appreciated...
 

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Snorton Norton said:
The first being Meguire's Softbuff cutting, polishing and finishing foam pads, here:

http://www.meguiars.com/product_showroom/showproducts_template.cfm?SrcLine=PT&SrcCat=0

Also found is the Durofoam variable contact foam pads and Viper Microfiber Bonnet from Classic Motoring Accessories, here:

http://www.properautocare.com/porcabac.html

And finially, the Orange Foam Polishing Pad, Red Foam Waxing Pad and the micro fiber wax removal bonnet from Groit's Garage, here:

http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?SKUupsell=10626
http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?SKUupsell=10628
http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?SKUupsell=11536


As I've read through all these products, here's what I think I'd like to do. I'll give it a couple days before ordering to read any comments from you folks.

I like the products Durofoam variable contact foam pads and Viper Microfiber Bonnet products from Classic Motoring Accessories. Here's what I'm likely to purchase:

Qty. 1) 6 inch Velcro Backup Plate - all pads below are velcro receivers
Qty. 2) White Polishing Pad - Surface cleaning and polishing
Qty. 1) Grey Finishing Pad - Wax application
Qty. 3) 6 inch Viper Microfiber Bonnet - product removal of cleaner, polish and wax
Qty. 1) 6 inch Lambswool Leveling Pad - for use under the 6 inch Viper Microfiber Bonnet

I like the above items because they are all matched to one another, and the fact that I want to be able to use the polisher to remove hazed product as well as buff the finish by using the Viper Microfiber Bonnet, and not by hand/terry cloth towel (something that the Meguiare's line does not yet have).

I assume that products from these three sources are "closed cell" foam products. I hear this term used, yet none of the manufacturers call it by that name in the product descriptions. They all just say "foam". Am I okay with the products from these three manufacturers for the most part?

Yeah, more expensive for sure. Just about $200.00 for the whole outfit, but I really believe it will pay for itself in time saved and keeping the black color looking its best.

Any and all comments appreciated...
Using the side of the buffer is exactly what you want to avoid. Using the side of the buffer is exactly what causes swirl and buffer marks. Using the side of a wool bonnet will cut into the paint and cause real nasty marks. The only part you are supposed to use is the flat face. This also goes for the foam pads, but they are much more forgiving. This why I made the comment about the contours of our cars being difficult to buff. :)

I have the Meguiar's foam pads since they came with my buffer originally and have just bought them since. They work very, very well and are closed cell foam. Stay away from the red "cutting" pad (I believe that's an open cell foam structure). It doesn't work with the random orbit polisher anyway, it's designed for high speed rotary buffing. I bought the set of three pads for $25 and they do every thing I need. I typically don't use the buffer to apply wax anyway, only cleaners and polishes. It's much easier to keep wax out of the rubber and plastic parts when applied by hand. ;)

Also, Meguiar's does have microfiber producst. They are called "Ultimate Wipes" and the "Ultimate Bonnet." I have both, but haven't tried the Ultimate Bonnet yet (it's fairly new). The Ultimate Wipes are really awsome.

See the bottom of this page:

http://www.meguiars.com/product_showroom/showproducts_template.cfm?SrcLine=CT

I think you are going to be much happier with the Porter Cable unit... :thumbsup:
 

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Discussion Starter #18
dbaudiopro said:
Using the side of the buffer is exactly what you want to avoid. Using the side of the buffer is exactly what causes swirl and buffer marks. Using the side of a wool bonnet will cut into the paint and cause real nasty marks. The only part you are supposed to use is the flat face. This also goes for the foam pads, but they are much more forgiving. This why I made the comment about the contours of our cars being difficult to buff.
I am such a rookie at this, but you guys are steering me right...

Thanks for the patience. To try and figure this out without the experience of our members would be much more difficult, and potentially a good money wasting venture. I really believe that I'm getting the best product for the money, and it will work perfectly for my purposes and ability, thanks to you folks...
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Update:

Well, just purchased the following from Classic Motoring Accessories:

Name Code Qty Each Options
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Porter Cable Accessories: VB 1 16.95
6 inch Velcro Back-up Plate

Porter Cable Accessories: 46-670VC 2 9.95
White Polishing Pad

Porter Cable Accessories: 46-770VC 1 9.95
Grey Finishing Pad

Porter Cable Accessories: 77-216 1 8.95
6 inch Lambswool Leveling Pad

Porter Cable Accessories: VPC-6BON2 1 15.95
PKG/2 6 inch Viper Microfiber Bonnets

Porter Cable Accessories: VPC-6BON 1 8.95
6 inch Viper Microfiber Bonnet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Subtotal 80.65
Shipping 13.95
Tax 0.00
Total 94.60

I figure in about a week or so you guys should hear me bitchin' about something to do with this... :wink:

Should be fun...
 
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