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Yep - common 2.7 failure point. Replace the bleeder housing and the metal pipe with ones from a dealer - a single part number gets you both parts. Do not use an aftermarket (Dorman) bleeder housing - they fail quickly. Improved OEM design moved the bleeder to the metal pipe, eliminating one failure point.

Intake plenum has to be removed to get screws out. Be sure to clean dirt and grit off top of lower intake before re-installing plenum so it doesn't interfere with gaskets sealing. Can re-use the plenum gaskets without problem.
 
Discussion starter · #7 ·
I know that the housing has problems. I am well read into the dodge intrepid 2000 2.7 (though not cars in general). I noticed the coolant levels were dropping, (because I check the oil and coolant everyday). I feared it was going into the engine, although I think now if weep hole breaks it will flood the engine immediately (or slowly overtime). So i filled the coolant up months ago and have just been waiting and noting the coolant loss. It was coming out of the housing unit, just a little, and not always. Well, I don't know if maybe I cycled through and literally ran out of coolant to leak, or blew it, or what. My dad said if I was leaking coolant from that part, air would get in and cause it to overheat, but its been months (i drive a lot, so, let's just say 5k miles, car has 110k. It about to rain where I am over the next couple days and so I have little room to work on it.

So, if you guys could answer a couple questions, I will return the favor. Here's some info first:

1. I know, for a fact, the housing was leaking. It would have the coolant setting right where the seal would be, right in a line, on the side (driver side).

2. No idea if this car has had the water pump changed. Bought it at 55k miles for 2500 because it had been hit on the driver side rear and I got a special price because of a connection through my dad (guy didn't make any money off the deal). I did find the original owner's extended warranty with the owners manual, and have considered tracking him/her down (only gives first and middle initials and last name, but also an address, which would be 15 years old if my math is correct. Just to ask if they did any work on it. It was in good interior condition when I bought it, and honestly seemed like the owner took great care.

3. At the end of April, I needed an oil change. I took it to the place I usually go. They drain my oil, and when I tell them I want advance/high mileage synthetic, they say all they have is regular. I don't have time for them to go get some from Wal mart, so I let them put it in thinking "I usually change mine at 2500 miles or so, but with this oil, I do it in 1250." The reason I change it at 2500 is because if coolant is getting into the engine oil, then it makes sense to change the oil more often than so that the viscosity doesn't get thrown off. I do it myself now with name brand oil and filter. About 1200 to 1400 miles later, I start my car and it runs like ****. engine wobbles so bad It is shaking the car. I'm not too far from home, so I grind it out. Get home, check oil, find chocolate milk. Flush the system, change the oil (letting it drain forever), and start it up. It runs a little rough at first, but it hasn't caused any problems. No milky stuff, oil leaked due to oil pressure sensor (which was changed), but l check under the hood everyday and never let it get below 1/2 quart short marker. I have no idea what the hell happened that day, because it ran fine the night before. I honestly think someone poured whatever into the engine. I kicked myself for allowing regular oil, but I honestly didn't have time because I couldn't miss class.

4. A year and a half ago, I started losing horse power. It was subtle at first, only caught it when I had to gun it across the highway. Would feel like it would hick-up. I have compensated for this problem by taking it easy on her. I need to changed the PCV valve, which might be the cause, but I'm hesitant to work on this car because I might mess it up and make a costly mistake.

5. Twice, I driven it at 75 MPH for 15-20 minutes (turnpike) and the check engine light came on. Misfires in multiple cylinders and random cylinders. I changed spark plugs. I haven't looked further into this problem because I don't go above 70.

6. I have checked the weep hole periodically, and have not noticed it leaking. However, due to the oil pressure gage leaking, the bottom of my car is covered in oil that needs to be cleaned off but I can't do it properly, plus I'm afraid of messing something up (Had I just sprayed it with water, it would could have gotten into the engine via oil pressure switch leak.)

7. I am paranoid about keeping this car running due to my circumstances, but I recognize I'm on borrowed time and plan to get something else this coming year. But not right now. $2500 dollars for over 50,000 miles isn't bad. I drive with the radio off just waiting for the car to explode.

Questions:
1. Is my dad is correct in that coolant coming out of the housing unit would cause air to come in? When I had my car flushed after the milky oil, the mechanic didn't bleed the housing unit because he said it breaks too easily (guy knows his ****). He sent me on my way and my top radiator hose blew shortly afterwards (guy doesn't know his ****). Me and my dad did the coolant drain and fill this time, and he bleed the air. So if air has been getting in, shouldn't I have been having problems for a long time, not just suddenly? Maybe the air getting in finally reached a threshold?

2.I'm about to get under and start checking some ****. I had it towed (free via insurance) but I looked underneath while I was waiting and noticed there was coolant that had run down so that I could see it on the undercarriage. The weep hole did not look like coolant had come out. So if I lost coolant elsewhere, where should I look? Housing unit, hoses, radiator, I know I'll check those, but any where else?

3. I checked the boiling point for 50/50 I use, and so maybe I finally leaked out too much coolant and caused the engine to get hot, causing the coolant to heat so much it melted/broke the bleed valve housing unit. The reason I haven't been adding more coolant is exactly this: if it is leaking outside the engine I want to know (as opposed to inside) and if it is leaking outside, how much? Changing the housing unit is going to be fun, since that's what it feels like I'll be doing. Any experiences with it slowly leaking to finally overheating?

4. I don't know where exactly that steam was coming from. Just couldn't tell and was more concerned about getting a video of it for diagnostic purposes. Also, didn't want to get burned. That is steam, right? Not white smoke, right?

5. I also need to change the belt on the passenger side because I've noticed it's worn at a certain point but have put it off until I had a couple things needing done (sense changing the belt correctly is quite a project). Also need PVC (PCV?) valve changed. Should I do this? I ask because I'm worried that if I change it, a) I'll do something wrong and catch the car on fire and b) I hear stories about cleaning transmissions and then they fail because the trans had clogged up the holes and cleaning it made it exposed. Will this happen with the PVC valve or any other thing I work on besides transmission (which I won't be doing that, BTW, is that cleaning the trans story actual something that happens?

6. Gasoline additives. I used them at first, but stopped when I realized that they might have the transmission thing effect: knocking old sludge lose and getting stuff messed up. Is this right or wrong?

7. Did having regular instead of synthetic oil that one time for 1200 miles cause the milk oil?

8.Is there other stuff I could do that will help my engine? I mean, I've read **** loads about it, but the people who do stuff sound like they know what they are doing. I've considered adjusting the coolant to water ratio to get the engine at an optimal temp, but I don't have an oil gauge, just temperature gauge (which, from what I've read, goes off coolant temperature and not oil, which is important).

9. The car got to 3/4 temp on the gauge when I noticed it, I slowed down from 70 to 50, where it immediately dropped to 1/2 temp, then started rising, at which point I pulled off to the best location (knowing I would be getting towed or needing to work on it). It almost got to the last white line before the red one. But the overheating light never came on, so this happened quick and I pulled off fast (killed engine within 10 seconds of it starting to climb. Why did it drop when I slowed down?

10. I had planned on dropping the oil pan and checking to see the extent of the sludge problem, as to gauge where I stood. However, I chickened out when I realized how hard it was going to be and that I could really mess things up, since I don't work on cars and could accidentally something bad (not a typo). Should I consider this? Main reason I didn't was because I have to take off the suspension bar (or hoist the engine up enough to slide it out) and I didn't feel comfortable doing that ****.

11. I have heard random clicking noises. I know it says I'm suppose to get to a mechanic, but I don't have money to pour into this. The clicking is almost alternating from the driver side to the passenger side. With the radio off and windows up, I hear and fear every sound that car makes. So what's this clicking sound? It's just a single click, not loud really.
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
Intake plenum? Is that the black round b**** on top with seven screws, wires wrapped around/underneath it, and makes working on the car so difficult? When you say removed, do you mean take off completely or just enough to get to those back screws?

I think I have taken it off before. Honestly, and I can't remember exactly, I think I did and replaced the seal. I dropped the seal, causing it to get dirty, and when I cleaned it off I stretched it (my dad couldn't yell at my fast enough). It not being correctly sized now, we cut so that is fit. It was rectangular and white. But I can't for the life of me remember what that seal went to. It had to be that housing unit (I remember having to get that manifold up enough to get to those screws). This was in march or so, and me and my dad were don't remember it exactly. Is it possible that's where the leak came from?
 
Discussion starter · #10 ·
Update

Here's a new video.

The housing is showed off in the first minute. I zoom at :40 to show where it usually accumulates.

After the first minute, I show top down from different angles so you can see where the stuff went.

At 3:00, I get down and show underneath the car, first from the passenger side, than the driver, than from the front looking back.

It ends with some more shots, but you can see what Im talking about.

Warning: I move the camera around quickly and sharply at some points, so if you get motion sickness easy, watch carefully.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2tzmFO9iuc

There's a lot of coolant that's leaked everywhere, and I mean everywhere. Leaked enough so that if it dripped form the housing unit, I don't see how it gets there, but I'm not 100% on that. Any thoughts?

P.S. At 5:00, I show the where oil had leaked from the plug and pressure sensor and accumulated underneath. It's thick and heavy, and makes identify leaks and drips hard. When people replace their oil pressure switch, warn them that it's going to be dirty under there from all the oil and be sure wear protective eye wear. Literally, anything I touched caused oil to break off and fall right on my face.
 
Sorry, I didn't know which one it went in, so I figured post in both, then move all the info into whatever one it should be in and then just delete the other one.
Who's going to do all that? This certainly doesn't belong under "Performance and Modifications".

I think you need on-site assistance. Don't take this as criticism, but your last post shows that you don't understand enough about how things work to be on your own with this kind of work. You're mixing a lot of stuff together that mostly have nothing to do with each other.
 
Did you replace the bleeder housing before? If so, must have been an aftermarket one.

Don't know which gasket you trimmed. I was referring to the plenum gaskets, which are oval and can't be trimmed. There is a gasket at the base of the bleeder housing. I can't remember what it looked like, but it can't be trimmed.
 
Discussion starter · #14 · (Edited)
Who's going to do all that? This certainly doesn't belong under "Performance and Modifications".

I think you need on-site assistance. Don't take this as criticism, but your last post shows that you don't understand enough about how things work to be on your own with this kind of work. You're mixing a lot of stuff together that mostly have nothing to do with each other.

I know that last post was loaded with stuff, but I just put all the information I could think of that might help. I mean, I'm not a car guy, like I said, but I am an Intrepid guy.

I do take what you say as criticism. Good, constructive, criticism. I don't know what I'm doing, and I know that. First thought was that housing unit, but I want to double check before I have to replace it. The second video shows more stuff. With the amount of coolant that you see in it, and the locations of it, do you still think it's from the housing unit? I mean, I guess it busted, leaked a lot and then got hot enough to steam off the coolant that had leaked behind the unit and under the manifold, where it would be the hottest. But Jesus, it shouldn't have been hot to do that.

I can't remember what it was. When my dad wakes up, I think I can pull up his O'Reilly's purchase history and see what it was (he gets military&disability discount, so I use his account). It was a rectangle, 3 inches by 1.5 inches (approx.), plastic, clear, and I screwed it up by pulling grass off it after dropping it.

EDIT: Found it somewhere else on the site. This is what I'm talking about in this thread:

http://www.dodgeintrepid.net/showthread.php?t=1224881&highlight=BLEEDER
 

Attachments

I know that last post was loaded with stuff, but I just put all the information I could think of that might help. I mean, I'm not a car guy, like I said, but I am an Intrepid guy.

I do take what you say as criticism. Good, constructive, criticism. I don't know what I'm doing, and I know that...
There's hope then. LOL! Seriously - it is a good sign that you realize that.

We'll work with you. Try to make separate threads on things that are not related to each other. For those cases where you're not certain if something is related to something else or not, put them together and we'll work with ya to separate the different causes and fixes.

First thought was that housing unit, but I want to double check before I have to replace it. The second video shows more stuff. With the amount of coolant that you see in it, and the locations of it, do you still think it's from the housing unit?
The real leak point or area is hidden from view (in the shadows behind the housing) in the videos. Ignoring for the moment that gasket you said you stretched and trimmed, almost certainly the problem is the seam around the underside of the top of the housing where it joins the rest of the body of the housing. Other than the metal bleeder seat separating from the plastic, the top separating is *the* main failure mode of those things. Sometimes the top blows almost completely off.

Now - perhaps that gasket (on the underside of the housing) that you trimmed is the problem in this special case (otherwise they almost never fail). But, again, if you replaced that housing with an aftermarket one, there is a super-high chance that the top separating is the problem.

To help you see better (without steam pouring in your face), you might want to get a loaner coolant pressure test kit from O'Reilly's or Advance. Pressure the system, and see if you can tell of the coolant is coming from where the top meets the main body of the housing *or* from where the bottom of the housing meets the lower intake (in which case that gasket is the problem).

I'll go so far as to say that if the housing is an aftermarket one, even if it presently is not the problem, you want to replace it and the gasket with OEM (for future reliability). The amount of work and difficulty is identical for both. Again, you want to replace the housing and the pipe, which will move the bleeder to being a welded fitting on the pipe. The gasket may come with the OEM housing - not 100% sure about hat though.

I mean, I guess it busted, leaked a lot and then got hot enough to steam off the coolant that had leaked behind the unit and under the manifold, where it would be the hottest. But Jesus, it shouldn't have been hot to do that.
Well, the coolant can be over 220°F (well over 212°F, which as you know is the boiling point of water). If your coolant is low due to the leak, it could be overheated. And I don't know if you have 50/50 mix to elevate the boiling temperature. Pressure in the system also additionally raises the boiling point, but with a leak/low coolant, there may be low pressure.
 
Discussion starter · #16 ·
http://www.dodgeintrepid.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=25113&d=1421259582


That white seal is what I stretched. We were able to remove the housing without taking the whole intake manifold off, via angling and loosening it (took a lot longer because I didn't realize there was a couple screws under the logo). We thought the thermostat was there. It wasn't.

I think we got a new housing unit on it. But it is the one that is centered, not moved down to the pipe. I'm trying to find the correct part, but from what I understand, I have to buy it from the maker, the whole unit, which is quite expensive. I'm not concerned with this thing lasting me that much longer, honestly. I don't want to put money into the car, but I don't mind time. Good practice. If I can work on this car and keep it running, then I'll feel good if and when I buy a newer car.

I've done this before, have the tools, and it's a pain. The housing unit blows off completely? Is that do to the pressure, and not necessarily overheating? House separates a little, leaks, and just blows from the pressure? That second video shows how much it has leaked, long before the steam came.

I'm trying to find the correct part if I do put the non after market housing unit on. Put from what I understand, it's over a $100? I've had this one on for 8 months, and it's been fine. (Think I pushed it with the coolant levels, but really wanted to see if the coolant lose was from the housing unit or weep hole).

I've thought of doing the water pump replacement. I have a cousin/neighbor who is a manager at a local Dodge dealer and when I mentioned how the water pump job was above my head, he was like "Oh, no. It's not that hard." Really wanted to laugh at that one, because it's an 80 dollar part but I really don't think I could do that job. I'd break mess it up. I don't want to replace the PVC valve due to how easy it is to break it off or tighten it too much.
 
Discussion starter · #18 ·
...We were able to remove the housing without taking the whole intake manifold off, via angling and loosening it (took a lot longer because I didn't realize there was a couple screws under the logo)...
True - you can do that. However, there is usually a lot of dirt and grit between the plenum and the lower intake, and you do run the risk of dirt getting under the gaskets and ending up with an intake leak. You might not, but it is a risk.

I think we got a new housing unit on it. But it is the one that is centered, not moved down to the pipe...
So if it was purchased in the last few years, it is the aftermarket one because the one with the bleeder in the housing top was discontinued by Chrysler several years ago, and for good reason. They had to get the problems our cars used to have fixed before introducing the new LX platform as the 2.7 was to be the base engine for the platform.

I'm trying to find the correct part, but from what I understand, I have to buy it from the maker, the whole unit, which is quite expensive...I've done this before, have the tools, and it's a pain. The housing unit blows off completely?
Pretty close to it. Once the top starts separating, it's just a matter of time as it peels more and more. The more it separates, the more coolant is lost; the more coolant is lost, the more overheating you get with more heat and possibly more pressure (flash steam like you're seeing).

Is that do to the pressure, and not necessarily overheating? House separates a little, leaks, and just blows from the pressure?...
Who's to say exactly, but it is a combination of temperature and pressure. The process of attaching that top is inadequate. Dorman still has a problem with it because - well, they're Dorman, and Chrysler used to, but they've improved them in that regard.

I'm trying to find the correct part if I do put the non after market housing unit on. Put from what I understand, it's over a $100? I've had this one on for 8 months, and it's been fine...
Unless you are sure it's the gasket that you trimmed that is leaking, it would appear from your videos that the housing is not fine.

...I don't want to replace the PVC valve due to how easy it is to break it off or tighten it too much.
That's happened to a few people, but I have to believe that it was way overtightened to do that. It is threaded into the plastic plenum, so you just snug it up - not tighten it like you would the same size bolt into metal. You can't just not service the PCV valve.

Here is the best deal that I have found on the coolant outlet housing. Under $50 shipped.

http://m.ebay.com/itm/New-Genuine-O...AR-Water-Outlet-Tube-with-Thermostat-Housing-5017183AB-/252135429683?nav=SEARCH
Very good!

That says it fits 2002-2004 Intrepids. Mine is 2000. The way it's built into the housing metal tube and runs straight back... That requires a lot more work.
If it helps, the housing and the metal pipe are separable. There is a reliable o-ring joint between them just like when you bought the housing separately. Comes with new o-ring.

I'm sure Peva can confirm, but I'm pretty sure that the improved one is the same for 98-04.
Yes - fits all years - put that one on my '99 with no problems. They are confused. All the original part pdf's from '98 thru 2004 say 4792329 - that's the one with the bleeder molded into the housing. That part supersedes to the improved design 5017183AB. Chrysler doesn't offer the old design any more - everybody converts over.
 
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